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join me for these intriguing stories and

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more perhaps you may be the one chosen

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by fate to solve a mystery

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so there are many reasons to have Rob

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Kristofferson on your show but I thought

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today we take a break from the news and

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the social networks and and dive into

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something that always gets us excited

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and terrified and that is unsolved

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mysteries now you not only have done

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several round tables on our strange

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skies podcast Rob on this show but you

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know more about these cases probably

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much more than anyone else I know so

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today I thought we'd take a look back at

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some of the most memorable UFO segments

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to ever grace the unsolved mysteries

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television show so Rob Kristofferson

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welcome to unsolved mysteries the UFO

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stack back thank you for having me on

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yeah unsolved mysteries is where my UFO

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education began it has to start

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somewhere man I mean hey mine was

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probably I'm trying to think what was

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like the first thing I ever saw

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maybe maybe one of these segments it

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very well could have been definitely

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x-files was a big one for me mm-hmm

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you know made the UFOs actually look

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cool for once so uh right yeah that did

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it for me but um I'm astounded when you

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and I decided to do this we we went back

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and looked at pretty much all the cases

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they covered I know there's some were

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probably missing but um there was so

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many first-time witnesses coming forward

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on unsolved mysteries I had no idea like

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it's astounding the people that they

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were able to get for each of these cases

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yeah absolutely I think there's this

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correlation between the public exposure

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of UFOs and eyewitnesses coming forward

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because you kind of saw similar things

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happen after Close Encounters of the

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Third Kind came out and there was this

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interesting article I read in an old

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issue a flying saucer review and the

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title of the article was called a case

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of rabbit snatching and it was about

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this guy who was in his 30s at the time

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but when he was a teenager

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he lived at an orphanage and he had

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rabbits that he kept and these rabbits

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kept disappearing and eventually he had

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this like extraordinary encounter in his

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bedroom with these beings that

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materialized out of nowhere and appeared

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at the like side of his bed and I don't

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understand how the guy wasn't freaked

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out but he wasn't freaked out about it

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and he saw it as a positive experience

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became a very spiritual person after

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that but he came forward to tell a story

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after Close Encounters of the Third Kind

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came out that's interesting yeah I'm

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sure there is an influx of reports that

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probably come in when stuff like this

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occurs because it's now on the minds of

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people and that actually came up with

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one of the skeptics in one of these

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episodes which we'll get to this idea

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that like these shows they compel people

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I mean look at unsolved mysteries

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overall I mean right they were solving

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murders and people drowning in quicksand

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left and right am i correct yeah pretty

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by I mean that that's definitely part of

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it unsolved mysteries and rescue 9-1-1

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with William Shatner they definitely

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helped to make it see yeah yeah and you

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know we we kind of we worship Robert

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Stack over here but we're gonna talk a

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little later about his actual thoughts

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on UFOs because doesn't really line up

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with a lot of what we're gonna cover

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today but that's a whole different story

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but um let's kinda I guess we'll go in

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chronological order Rob if you don't

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mind yeah yeah so of course they had to

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cover the mother of all cases Roswell in

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1947

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craft crashed at a remote New Mexico

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field metal debris and sparkling

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property was covered with unusual

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markings witnesses claimed it was a UFO

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military here at wazzle Army Air Base in

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New Mexico immediately announced that

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the object was a UFO within our change

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their story and said it was only a

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downed weather balloon the military

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conceal the most astounding discovery of

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the century and we open on McGrath oh

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the man yeah so he's looking like a

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young Sam Elliot and we might as well

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Sarah here so they reenact everything on

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the show which is amazing and I mean

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they do a really really good job so yeah

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we open UNMIK brazil angrily eating

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dinner during a thunderstorm and dude

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that mustache that was something else

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yeah was actually exactly that this guy

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looks like Sam Elliot oh really it's

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pretty amazing yeah you get Mac Brazel

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just sitting there eating dinner there's

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a lightning storm going on all around

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and all of a sudden he just gets up but

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he's like that didn't sound like any

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just old lightning strike and he goes

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out to his front porch to look out see

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if he could see anything and you know

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it's it's a very nice dramatic shot oh

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yeah what a way to start this thing out

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and I mean so yeah you know he goes out

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there and hears this and we know the

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Wilmots were some of the first stuff

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come forward and say they saw something

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going through the sky that night and

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that it was kind of coming down and

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possibly crashing or landing and then we

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get a we get one of the first interviews

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ever with Loretta Proctor one of the

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ranch owners next-door to Mac Brazel and

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oh my god man she was a sweetheart I

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would have loved to have met her yeah

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absolutely she it's very approachable

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down-to-earth kind of person she attests

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to Mac Brazel being you know this kind

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of guy that wouldn't make stories up he

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was trustworthy and yeah he everything

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that's to come with the guys probably

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definitely happened

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exactly yeah and I think that's gonna be

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a running theme to tonight is uh

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unsolved mysteries loved spending time

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on like giving credibility to the people

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coming forward with this stuff like to

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the point where it was like okay we get

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it

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they're a normal person they're not

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crazy we get it we did that's the thing

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I made this point on Twitter I think

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last week but it's like there are two

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categories of people that are UFO

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witnesses that are good and they're

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either trained observers or there are

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people so mundane in the world that they

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couldn't possibly be making it helped

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yeah it is pretty it's one or the other

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it's one thing yeah all right so we see

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uh-oh Kevin Randall makes an appearance

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in this with an equally epic mustache I

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must say yes he's bringing the mustache

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you know bring in the broad shouldered

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suit I love it yeah well this was

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interesting so for those who don't know

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Kevin Randall is one of the leading

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researchers on Roswell

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you know along with Tom Kerry Don

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Schmidt and I thought it was interesting

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Rendell refused to call the debris the

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metal that was found in the desert that

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night metal he kept stating that the

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original description was like a shiny

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plastic yeah yeah I thought that was

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pretty interesting because even to me to

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this day I think of all this stuff is

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having been metal like straight-up metal

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yeah and even loretta Proctor because

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once Mac Brazel goes out the next

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morning which is July 3rd 1947 he finds

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the debris field which is about

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three-quarters of a mile long and I

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think like a few hundred feet wide he

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takes some of it he goes to the proctors

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his closest neighbors and when I say

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closest neighbors they're like 10 miles

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away or something like that and loretta

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Proctor described the wreckage that he

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had as kind of wood but then she would

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say uh you know if I you know talking

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about it today I would say more

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resembled like plastic but when they

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tried to light it on fire because I

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guess everybody just tries to lie

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you know random pieces of debris on fire

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it wouldn't do so they couldn't cut it

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and yeah I found that very odd like it's

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not metal it's plastic that's very

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strange to me it is it is but you know I

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mean that's what they saw and what they

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experienced I thought I thought this is

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funny - after they like tried to burn it

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cut it no they cut back to actual

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Loretta talking to us and she's like oh

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yeah I mean McGrath said we should

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probably go out there and check out what

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it is she says we should just yeah we

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probably should go out there and see

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what crashed but now what we didn't do

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that so great is there bad are there

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more important things going on than a

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crashed UFO and they're gotta go you

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gotta tend to that livestock man you got

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to make sure that arm is Rondon hey

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that's a good point yeah that is their

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bread and butter for sure yeah

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so I mean this kind of follows the you

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know the narrative of Roswell they phone

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Roswell Army Airfield Jesse Marcel comes

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out to take a look and this was cool

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they showed an interview with Jesse

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Marcel senior from a documentary which

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they didn't really do often on unsolved

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mysteries like use other footage from

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other things so I thought that was

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pretty cool yeah yeah absolutely yeah

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they they really don't you know

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sometimes you'll see like a map that's

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like computer-generated that they draw

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or something like that but like yeah

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it's never usually other video footage

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so I did enjoy that part of it for sure

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they were just fragments tune all over

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the area in the area about

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three-quarters of a mile long and

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several hundred feet wide so we

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proceeded to pick up the parts since I

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tried to mend the stuff says it will not

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Bend I even tried to burn that

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see our stuff weighs nothing it's not in

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there thicker than tinfoil in a pack of

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cigarettes since we even tried making a

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dent in it with a 16 pound sledge hammer

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still no dent in it one thing I was

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certain of being familiar with all our

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activities that it was not a weather

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balloon nor an aircraft nor a missile it

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was something else which we didn't know

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what it was yeah it was a great

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interview I think you can find it online

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and its entirety this is a pretty

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condensed version but um yeah so I mean

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Marcel goes out there with a

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sledgehammer he starts going to town on

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this thing I'm just imagining like a

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military guy in uniform middle of a

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desert like going nuts on a piece of

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plastic you know okay I love how yeah

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they've got Sheridan Cavitt holding it

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and Marcel just like trying to smack the

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hell out of it's so great it's like all

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the dudes in the first Thor movie trying

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to get the hammer out yeah hold my beer

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all right what else

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Oh a Jesse Marcel jr. as well we get his

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story about his dad bringing wreckage

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home there's these i-beams with weird

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edgings on them and then we get a sweet

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phone acting between Walter Haught and

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Colonel William Blanchard but the flying

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00:12:15,549 --> 00:12:15,019
disc it's so good it's so great - yes

272
00:12:20,889 --> 00:12:15,559
sir

273
00:12:24,340 --> 00:12:20,899
angry over the phone with one another

274
00:12:26,949 --> 00:12:24,350
just do what I tell you here's my

275
00:12:29,289 --> 00:12:26,959
question stack says that the wreckage

276
00:12:31,569 --> 00:12:29,299
was flown to Wright Field Ohio which is

277
00:12:33,789 --> 00:12:31,579
like what most of us know but they made

278
00:12:35,949 --> 00:12:33,799
this stop in Fort Worth Texas now Rob I

279
00:12:39,759 --> 00:12:35,959
know this was i I think this has been

280
00:12:41,350 --> 00:12:39,769
proven but do you know why some of it

281
00:12:45,069 --> 00:12:41,360
was brought to Fort Worth before they

282
00:12:48,159 --> 00:12:45,079
went to a write Patterson not really you

283
00:12:50,259 --> 00:12:48,169
know it's just like we're gonna make a

284
00:12:53,949 --> 00:12:50,269
quick stop by the like it doesn't really

285
00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:53,959
make sense unless they decided I don't

286
00:12:58,659 --> 00:12:55,730
know in the air or something like that

287
00:13:02,980 --> 00:12:58,669
it may be maybe word got to them that

288
00:13:04,070 --> 00:13:02,990
they had leaked or had gone to the press

289
00:13:06,019 --> 00:13:04,080
to say all we

290
00:13:07,850 --> 00:13:06,029
recovered a flying saucer maybe they got

291
00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:07,860
word in the air I'm not sure yeah I

292
00:13:10,910 --> 00:13:08,610
don't know either

293
00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:10,920
um I mean but Kevin Randall even says in

294
00:13:14,210 --> 00:13:12,810
this episodes like he thinks stuff was

295
00:13:17,210 --> 00:13:14,220
getting shipped everywhere he says

296
00:13:19,009 --> 00:13:17,220
Langley CIA headquarters MacDill Air

297
00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:19,019
Force Base in Florida like what that

298
00:13:24,079 --> 00:13:21,810
what why why is some of it going to

299
00:13:26,870 --> 00:13:24,089
Langley some to Florida some detect I

300
00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:26,880
this is interesting maybe it was all a

301
00:13:31,009 --> 00:13:28,890
plan to like keep all this stuff

302
00:13:33,530 --> 00:13:31,019
separated so that no one could find out

303
00:13:36,199 --> 00:13:33,540
where like the one true source was for

304
00:13:38,750 --> 00:13:36,209
what they found I don't know maybe but

305
00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:38,760
like it makes sense to go to right field

306
00:13:42,290 --> 00:13:40,410
because I mean air technical

307
00:13:45,949 --> 00:13:42,300
intelligence command is there these are

308
00:13:48,470 --> 00:13:45,959
the people that basically study like

309
00:13:51,610 --> 00:13:48,480
reverse not reverse engineer well they

310
00:13:53,750 --> 00:13:51,620
kind of reverse engineer like enemy

311
00:13:55,970 --> 00:13:53,760
technology and stuff like that so it

312
00:13:57,769 --> 00:13:55,980
made sense at the time but like it

313
00:13:59,720 --> 00:13:57,779
doesn't really make sense to ship things

314
00:14:02,810 --> 00:13:59,730
here there and everywhere when you have

315
00:14:06,350 --> 00:14:02,820
one area that does that it's it's not

316
00:14:07,850 --> 00:14:06,360
like a lot of experimental stuff goes on

317
00:14:11,210 --> 00:14:07,860
at the basis that they were talking

318
00:14:13,910 --> 00:14:11,220
about but you know a lot of people have

319
00:14:15,500 --> 00:14:13,920
added on to the Roswell narrative ever

320
00:14:18,620 --> 00:14:15,510
since this came out and it should be

321
00:14:21,710 --> 00:14:18,630
noted like this is the first time that

322
00:14:25,250 --> 00:14:21,720
Roswell was broadcast to a general

323
00:14:28,130 --> 00:14:25,260
public this is where it blew up his on

324
00:14:30,620 --> 00:14:28,140
unsolved mysteries and like it aired and

325
00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:30,630
then the season premiere was I think

326
00:14:38,930 --> 00:14:35,810
September of 89 and they reared it in

327
00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:38,940
January of 1990 and it got even bigger

328
00:14:46,069 --> 00:14:41,850
ratings the second time so like the idea

329
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:46,079
of like UFO crashes was something that

330
00:14:51,949 --> 00:14:50,370
even in the UFO research world was kind

331
00:14:54,050 --> 00:14:51,959
of like shell for a long period of time

332
00:14:56,420 --> 00:14:54,060
it's like no UFOs didn't crash the

333
00:14:59,300 --> 00:14:56,430
government doesn't have anything it's

334
00:15:02,590 --> 00:14:59,310
all just you know the this identified

335
00:15:05,180 --> 00:15:02,600
stuff and then you know in 78 when

336
00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:05,190
Stanton Friedman gets the first Inklings

337
00:15:10,900 --> 00:15:09,690
of you know a UFO crash and he's told to

338
00:15:13,639 --> 00:15:10,910
talk to Jesse Marcel

339
00:15:16,790 --> 00:15:13,649
that same year is when Leonard

340
00:15:18,950 --> 00:15:16,800
Stringfield delivered his presentation

341
00:15:22,580 --> 00:15:18,960
about

342
00:15:24,170 --> 00:15:22,590
crash recoveries so like it all started

343
00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:24,180
to come out at the same time and then

344
00:15:30,170 --> 00:15:27,690
this is where Roswell started to become

345
00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:30,180
a household name right yeah you're so

346
00:15:35,180 --> 00:15:32,610
right man like without a few chance

347
00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:35,190
encounters and like rumblings here and

348
00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:37,770
there from Friedman and Jesse Marcel jr.

349
00:15:42,350 --> 00:15:40,050
and everyone like this may never have

350
00:15:43,700 --> 00:15:42,360
seen the light of day again so yeah I

351
00:15:45,860 --> 00:15:43,710
think we have a lot of people to thank

352
00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:45,870
for that and they do have Stanton

353
00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:48,810
Friedman in this episode and you know

354
00:15:53,390 --> 00:15:51,090
this is the first time I'd seen him in

355
00:15:54,950 --> 00:15:53,400
something or heard him Rob since he

356
00:15:57,440 --> 00:15:54,960
passed away and just hearing his voice

357
00:16:02,210 --> 00:15:57,450
and seeing those eyebrows it brought

358
00:16:04,340 --> 00:16:02,220
back so many good memories oh man yeah I

359
00:16:07,430 --> 00:16:04,350
had a smile on my face and like god I

360
00:16:10,070 --> 00:16:07,440
love this man he just his convictions he

361
00:16:11,630 --> 00:16:10,080
sticks to him there's a soul so great so

362
00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:11,640
great I think what's interesting here

363
00:16:17,540 --> 00:16:15,050
too is hottt takes the press release

364
00:16:19,430 --> 00:16:17,550
physically to like the different news

365
00:16:20,690 --> 00:16:19,440
agencies and the radio and all that

366
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:20,700
stuff so I found that kind of

367
00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:22,170
interesting you know instead of like

368
00:16:25,370 --> 00:16:23,970
sending out a wire or something like

369
00:16:26,150 --> 00:16:25,380
that you were hand delivering it

370
00:16:27,950 --> 00:16:26,160
personally

371
00:16:30,110 --> 00:16:27,960
that's interesting that is yeah you got

372
00:16:32,510 --> 00:16:30,120
to wonder like hopefully like nothing

373
00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:32,520
gets lost in translation like it has to

374
00:16:35,300 --> 00:16:33,570
be word-for-word

375
00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:35,310
you know I wonder if that had something

376
00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:38,130
to do with it I will never know no

377
00:16:42,230 --> 00:16:39,810
that's a good point though that brings

378
00:16:45,290 --> 00:16:42,240
up the whole you know controversy with

379
00:16:48,140 --> 00:16:45,300
this headline comes out RAAF captures

380
00:16:49,850 --> 00:16:48,150
flying discs and ranch near Roswell and

381
00:16:52,130 --> 00:16:49,860
then the next day it's retracted we all

382
00:16:54,620 --> 00:16:52,140
know that story by now you mentioned

383
00:16:58,010 --> 00:16:54,630
something Rob about adding on to the

384
00:16:59,930 --> 00:16:58,020
Roswell story and they kind of did this

385
00:17:02,360 --> 00:16:59,940
in the episode with this dude Barney

386
00:17:05,180 --> 00:17:02,370
Barnett now this was a story I'd heard

387
00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:05,190
of this was a engineer out of Socorro

388
00:17:10,340 --> 00:17:08,490
which we'll get to just a coincidence

389
00:17:13,070 --> 00:17:10,350
with that one but uh yes dude from

390
00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:13,080
Socorro New Mexico he finds a circular

391
00:17:19,220 --> 00:17:16,770
craft and bodies so now we've raised the

392
00:17:21,740 --> 00:17:19,230
level of Roswell not just debris not

393
00:17:24,260 --> 00:17:21,750
just whatever metal plastic but um

394
00:17:26,510 --> 00:17:24,270
bodies for bodies on the ground in

395
00:17:30,350 --> 00:17:26,520
spacesuits he said so yeah had you heard

396
00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:30,360
about this dude Barney Barnett yeah he

397
00:17:35,570 --> 00:17:31,170
was a

398
00:17:37,490 --> 00:17:35,580
kind of a big guy in San Friedman's book

399
00:17:40,820 --> 00:17:37,500
crash a Corona

400
00:17:43,610 --> 00:17:40,830
and the the thing about him is like the

401
00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:43,620
stories about Barney Barnett coming upon

402
00:17:50,420 --> 00:17:47,370
the crash site are always second or

403
00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:50,430
third hand but apparently he told a lot

404
00:17:56,690 --> 00:17:52,650
of people about this and what's

405
00:17:59,990 --> 00:17:56,700
interesting is is like later we're told

406
00:18:03,740 --> 00:18:00,000
about the mga 12 documents and in the

407
00:18:07,190 --> 00:18:03,750
memo in particular it says in the memo

408
00:18:09,830 --> 00:18:07,200
that the crash site was discovered I

409
00:18:12,980 --> 00:18:09,840
think like two or three miles from the

410
00:18:15,260 --> 00:18:12,990
debris field well the thing about Barney

411
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:15,270
Barnett is that he wasn't two to three

412
00:18:20,540 --> 00:18:17,850
miles away he was like 75 miles away on

413
00:18:24,500 --> 00:18:20,550
the plains of st. Augustine which was

414
00:18:27,500 --> 00:18:24,510
kind of the central thesis of crash at

415
00:18:29,810 --> 00:18:27,510
Corona is that at the corona site you

416
00:18:32,780 --> 00:18:29,820
had the debris field you know right

417
00:18:34,820 --> 00:18:32,790
outside the branch that Brazel was

418
00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:34,830
working on and then 75 miles away you

419
00:18:39,530 --> 00:18:37,770
had the actual craft there and like the

420
00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:39,540
the narrative has kind of changed over

421
00:18:45,050 --> 00:18:42,480
the years to some say it's to craft and

422
00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:45,060
then some say well no the craft was

423
00:18:49,550 --> 00:18:47,250
discovered yet a couple miles away from

424
00:18:51,830 --> 00:18:49,560
the ranch but like that's the thing it

425
00:18:53,660 --> 00:18:51,840
gets kind of confused here but I had

426
00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:53,670
heard Barney Barnett's story before and

427
00:18:58,880 --> 00:18:56,570
I had also heard the story of the

428
00:19:00,880 --> 00:18:58,890
archaeology students that stumbled upon

429
00:19:04,310 --> 00:19:00,890
it at the same time that he did and

430
00:19:07,070 --> 00:19:04,320
there's kind of an update later it's

431
00:19:10,580 --> 00:19:07,080
maybe like three or four years later in

432
00:19:12,770 --> 00:19:10,590
the same episode that where you're

433
00:19:16,010 --> 00:19:12,780
covering another story from in this

434
00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:16,020
episode but okay I there was another

435
00:19:20,630 --> 00:19:17,850
witness that allegedly went out there

436
00:19:23,570 --> 00:19:20,640
and saw the bodies too but yeah Barney

437
00:19:27,070 --> 00:19:23,580
Barnett he's kind of just this infamous

438
00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:27,080
guy known by name because like he

439
00:19:32,870 --> 00:19:29,250
Stanton Friedman never met him he died

440
00:19:36,980 --> 00:19:32,880
in 1969 but like everybody just came

441
00:19:40,550 --> 00:19:36,990
forward when Stan Friedman was doing the

442
00:19:42,020 --> 00:19:40,560
initial research on this case and just

443
00:19:43,910 --> 00:19:42,030
basically said oh yeah I talked to

444
00:19:45,550 --> 00:19:43,920
Barney bar dad he talked about the story

445
00:19:48,620 --> 00:19:45,560
all the time

446
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:48,630
there you go there you go well let's uh

447
00:19:53,360 --> 00:19:51,570
let's stay on Stan Friedman for a minute

448
00:19:55,250 --> 00:19:53,370
here Rob I've never actually asked you

449
00:19:57,920 --> 00:19:55,260
this and I can't believe it hasn't come

450
00:20:00,200 --> 00:19:57,930
up in conversation but majestic 12 um

451
00:20:02,390 --> 00:20:00,210
makes an appearance in this episode as

452
00:20:05,150 --> 00:20:02,400
well and what are your thoughts on mj-12

453
00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:05,160
these papers have you ever looked into

454
00:20:09,350 --> 00:20:06,810
it do you think there's any credence

455
00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:09,360
behind any of it yeah what what do you

456
00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:11,730
what is it first of all would you mind

457
00:20:15,170 --> 00:20:13,650
telling some of our listeners who might

458
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:15,180
not be familiar with it what exactly

459
00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:18,090
this this thing is and should we even

460
00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:23,210
pay attention to it so following the

461
00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:27,210
Roswell crash allegedly Truman put

462
00:20:35,750 --> 00:20:30,770
together this group of 12 members that

463
00:20:38,390 --> 00:20:35,760
were allegedly designed to cover up

464
00:20:41,810 --> 00:20:38,400
aliens existence in the Roswell incident

465
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:41,820
and all this stuff and I don't put a

466
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:43,890
whole lot of stock into it just because

467
00:20:48,860 --> 00:20:46,170
of like I know but jessic 12 was a thing

468
00:20:53,510 --> 00:20:48,870
I just don't think it was designed to

469
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:53,520
you know keep UFO secrecy in place I

470
00:20:58,730 --> 00:20:54,810
don't think that's what it was there for

471
00:21:02,570 --> 00:20:58,740
I think in my conversations with MJ

472
00:21:04,940 --> 00:21:02,580
B'nai as he pointed to other documents

473
00:21:08,570 --> 00:21:04,950
that indicate that MJ 12 was more

474
00:21:11,930 --> 00:21:08,580
related to atomic fallout but the thing

475
00:21:15,350 --> 00:21:11,940
is is that the way that the documents

476
00:21:17,420 --> 00:21:15,360
made became known as through you know

477
00:21:21,050 --> 00:21:17,430
Bill Moore and Jaime Chandra and you

478
00:21:24,710 --> 00:21:21,060
know Bill Moore he went on later to just

479
00:21:29,030 --> 00:21:24,720
basically you know spoil his career in

480
00:21:30,350 --> 00:21:29,040
ufology and hung it up in 89 so like you

481
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:30,360
kind of got a look at those documents

482
00:21:36,410 --> 00:21:32,970
you know with a grain of salt because

483
00:21:38,810 --> 00:21:36,420
like it's almost cinematic when you read

484
00:21:40,820 --> 00:21:38,820
about the way that these documents were

485
00:21:43,540 --> 00:21:40,830
dropped off because it's basically Jaime

486
00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:43,550
Sandra was sitting at home and this

487
00:21:50,870 --> 00:21:46,530
package just like is like shoved through

488
00:21:52,580 --> 00:21:50,880
his mail slot and he he gets this

489
00:21:54,590 --> 00:21:52,590
envelope and inside that there's like

490
00:21:57,230 --> 00:21:54,600
film and they develop it and it's like

491
00:21:58,670 --> 00:21:57,240
oh there's these memos like right here

492
00:22:01,010 --> 00:21:58,680
and like it's something that's

493
00:22:02,780 --> 00:22:01,020
built on over the years like the Psalm

494
00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:02,790
101 manual is part of the mj-12

495
00:22:07,430 --> 00:22:05,850
documents there are like other documents

496
00:22:10,550 --> 00:22:07,440
that even came out just like a few years

497
00:22:12,470 --> 00:22:10,560
ago so it keeps getting added on to but

498
00:22:15,410 --> 00:22:12,480
I just don't I don't put a lot of stock

499
00:22:17,300 --> 00:22:15,420
into it but I mean Santa Friedman did

500
00:22:20,870 --> 00:22:17,310
everything that he could to try to

501
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:20,880
authenticate those documents even John

502
00:22:25,700 --> 00:22:23,490
Tenney helped whip that back in the 80s

503
00:22:28,130 --> 00:22:25,710
I guess like when they were trying to

504
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:28,140
test like the typewriters that they

505
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:30,330
would use he he offered up his

506
00:22:38,590 --> 00:22:35,010
typewriter and with a sample so yeah

507
00:22:41,270 --> 00:22:38,600
it's it's part of that 80's

508
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:41,280
disinformation age of stuff where you

509
00:22:45,230 --> 00:22:43,290
have to take that information with a

510
00:22:46,910 --> 00:22:45,240
grain of salt there are good cases out

511
00:22:49,130 --> 00:22:46,920
there and some of them were feet gonna

512
00:22:51,710 --> 00:22:49,140
be featured in this episode but yeah I

513
00:22:53,510 --> 00:22:51,720
just I take them with a grain of salt I

514
00:22:55,910 --> 00:22:53,520
don't put a lot of stock into them but

515
00:22:59,180 --> 00:22:55,920
they're an interesting part of this

516
00:23:01,460 --> 00:22:59,190
crazy UFO history yep absolutely it's

517
00:23:04,580 --> 00:23:01,470
all part of it somehow whether we want

518
00:23:05,180 --> 00:23:04,590
it to be or not you know and of course I

519
00:23:07,790 --> 00:23:05,190
knew

520
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:07,800
teni had to be somewhat involved with

521
00:23:13,970 --> 00:23:11,610
majestic 12 somehow someway six degrees

522
00:23:16,190 --> 00:23:13,980
of John 10 probably find a way to

523
00:23:16,670 --> 00:23:16,200
connect him to every case tonight yeah

524
00:23:21,830 --> 00:23:16,680
pretty much

525
00:23:24,740 --> 00:23:21,840
yeah well we get a good a good testimony

526
00:23:27,830 --> 00:23:24,750
from Captain Pappy Henderson who said he

527
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:27,840
flew with this stuff and saw bodies this

528
00:23:32,090 --> 00:23:29,970
that I don't know Rob anything else in

529
00:23:34,430 --> 00:23:32,100
this episode that you really thought was

530
00:23:36,410 --> 00:23:34,440
worth bringing up before we move on yeah

531
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:36,420
I think I think we've hit on the the

532
00:23:42,380 --> 00:23:39,530
major points I mean it was nice to

533
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:42,390
Stanton Friedman comes out and basically

534
00:23:45,950 --> 00:23:44,250
says well the reason they would want to

535
00:23:48,020 --> 00:23:45,960
cover this up is because we just went

536
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:48,030
through a second world war and nobody

537
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:50,850
would be able to handle the existence of

538
00:23:54,740 --> 00:23:52,890
extraterrestrials at the time which God

539
00:23:57,470 --> 00:23:54,750
blessed that man I love that man for

540
00:24:01,990 --> 00:23:57,480
coming at at us like that but like yeah

541
00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:02,000
maybe maybe not that's why the Roswell

542
00:24:08,690 --> 00:24:05,690
mystery indoors is because there is no

543
00:24:10,700 --> 00:24:08,700
definitive answer and yet there are more

544
00:24:12,360 --> 00:24:10,710
people and more accounts that keep

545
00:24:14,310 --> 00:24:12,370
getting added on to it after

546
00:24:18,049 --> 00:24:14,320
this and I mean there's been countless

547
00:24:23,220 --> 00:24:18,059
books written about it so definitely the

548
00:24:26,250 --> 00:24:23,230
classic case example of what ufology can

549
00:24:28,230 --> 00:24:26,260
offer up absolutely and I mean you still

550
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:28,240
have idiots making television shows

551
00:24:35,820 --> 00:24:32,650
about Ross wait wait what I wait wait

552
00:24:38,310 --> 00:24:35,830
you wait I thought there was someone

553
00:24:38,970 --> 00:24:38,320
else in my studio here never mind it's

554
00:24:44,250 --> 00:24:38,980
just a mirror

555
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:44,260
whoops anyways moving on to actually not

556
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:47,290
moving too far year wise yes but not

557
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:50,250
location will move into Socorro

558
00:24:56,820 --> 00:24:54,610
Socorro New Mexico 1964 it began as a

559
00:25:00,180 --> 00:24:56,830
routine police pursuit just a wild

560
00:25:02,820 --> 00:25:00,190
teenager tooling through town one of the

561
00:25:05,700 --> 00:25:02,830
most remarkable UFO episodes in history

562
00:25:08,070 --> 00:25:05,710
of Close Encounters still impossible to

563
00:25:10,950 --> 00:25:08,080
ignore Rob I know this is one of your

564
00:25:14,100 --> 00:25:10,960
favorite cases so this is gonna be a fun

565
00:25:17,010 --> 00:25:14,110
one we open on Lonnie Zamora literally

566
00:25:19,980 --> 00:25:17,020
parking at the police station a car

567
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:19,990
whizzes past and he immediately gets

568
00:25:24,150 --> 00:25:21,850
back in his car and starts pursuing this

569
00:25:26,130 --> 00:25:24,160
car for speeding that dude whoever was

570
00:25:30,780 --> 00:25:26,140
in this car had a lot of guts speeding

571
00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:30,790
past a police station like that look at

572
00:25:35,580 --> 00:25:32,290
the guy on the screen he doesn't look

573
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:35,590
like he's going all that he doesn't but

574
00:25:42,060 --> 00:25:38,410
man Lonnie Zamora was ready to meet that

575
00:25:43,980 --> 00:25:42,070
quota wasn't he he had severe regrets

576
00:25:46,799 --> 00:25:43,990
about the not meeting that quote at the

577
00:25:48,450 --> 00:25:46,809
end of the day and I just it makes him

578
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:48,460
so much more human but yeah I like how

579
00:25:53,070 --> 00:25:50,770
they set up this like cinematic approach

580
00:25:55,530 --> 00:25:53,080
here at the beginning you got Lonnie

581
00:25:57,600 --> 00:25:55,540
Zamora just exiting his vehicle he turns

582
00:26:01,350 --> 00:25:57,610
around dramatically he's like I got a

583
00:26:02,850 --> 00:26:01,360
catch that's it was a slow day I think

584
00:26:06,030 --> 00:26:02,860
he even admitted that in this episode

585
00:26:08,549 --> 00:26:06,040
but um at the same time he's pursuing

586
00:26:11,070 --> 00:26:08,559
this dude like what I would assume was

587
00:26:12,510 --> 00:26:11,080
for a really long time they're going

588
00:26:15,390 --> 00:26:12,520
through the city and then they're going

589
00:26:18,299 --> 00:26:15,400
out into the desert so I mean whoever

590
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:18,309
was you know in that car was not

591
00:26:23,370 --> 00:26:20,530
stopping for Lonnie Zamora anytime soon

592
00:26:25,020 --> 00:26:23,380
no he wasn't he was just like I'm

593
00:26:26,190 --> 00:26:25,030
wondering if the guy was just completely

594
00:26:29,970 --> 00:26:26,200
oblivious to the

595
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:29,980
that he was being chased I'm just

596
00:26:34,290 --> 00:26:32,050
joyriding you know I got my top down I

597
00:26:36,750 --> 00:26:34,300
can't hear anything is that a police

598
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:36,760
siren oh well let's just keep going just

599
00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:38,890
keep going or let's get really

600
00:26:44,310 --> 00:26:41,050
conspiratorial maybe he was leading

601
00:26:46,020 --> 00:26:44,320
Lonnie Zamora out to where something is

602
00:26:48,690 --> 00:26:46,030
about to happen what do you think right

603
00:26:50,490 --> 00:26:48,700
right it almost seems like a setup in

604
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:50,500
many ways especially when you read the

605
00:26:56,070 --> 00:26:53,290
account in in any book that you want to

606
00:26:58,140 --> 00:26:56,080
pick up it's just like was this dude set

607
00:26:59,940 --> 00:26:58,150
the [\h__\h] up you gotta kind of wonder and

608
00:27:01,800 --> 00:26:59,950
I'm like I don't really want to feed the

609
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:01,810
skeptics cuz [\h__\h] the skeptics at this

610
00:27:06,570 --> 00:27:03,850
point because their explanations are

611
00:27:09,780 --> 00:27:06,580
dumb yeah yeah we'll get a few of those

612
00:27:12,530 --> 00:27:09,790
dumb explanations as we go on here but

613
00:27:14,580 --> 00:27:12,540
um so it's gonna paint the picture for

614
00:27:16,110 --> 00:27:14,590
anyone in the audience that doesn't know

615
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:16,120
about this case we have Lonnie Zamora

616
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:20,050
who is we should mention a cop if that

617
00:27:24,330 --> 00:27:21,490
wasn't clear already after what we just

618
00:27:26,430 --> 00:27:24,340
talked about but um they got him they

619
00:27:29,370 --> 00:27:26,440
got him on camera and he's recounting

620
00:27:32,310 --> 00:27:29,380
this event and I just love hearing him

621
00:27:33,750 --> 00:27:32,320
tell this story so Rob would you mind

622
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:33,760
maybe giving us like the Cliff Notes

623
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:35,770
version of what happened once he got out

624
00:27:42,300 --> 00:27:38,170
there and noticed something in the sky

625
00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:42,310
yeah so as they're approaching the edge

626
00:27:49,500 --> 00:27:45,970
of town Lonnie Zamora sees this kind of

627
00:27:52,650 --> 00:27:49,510
like blue flame up in the sky and he

628
00:27:55,620 --> 00:27:52,660
hears this roaring sound so he knows

629
00:27:58,080 --> 00:27:55,630
that he's in the approximate location of

630
00:27:59,690 --> 00:27:58,090
where a dynamite Shack owned by the

631
00:28:02,160 --> 00:27:59,700
mayor which just sounds like the

632
00:28:04,530 --> 00:28:02,170
beginning of like a sannyasa [\h__\h]

633
00:28:07,500 --> 00:28:04,540
comedy here but like he's like oh it

634
00:28:12,450 --> 00:28:07,510
must have exploded so he turns off onto

635
00:28:15,990 --> 00:28:12,460
this gravel road and he leads to kind of

636
00:28:18,060 --> 00:28:16,000
an Arroyo he crests this hill it takes

637
00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:18,070
him a little bit to get up there he he

638
00:28:24,870 --> 00:28:21,490
has to try a few times but as he crests

639
00:28:26,730 --> 00:28:24,880
the first part of it he sees what he

640
00:28:29,070 --> 00:28:26,740
thinks is an overturned card a couple of

641
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:29,080
people have ways I could see a white

642
00:28:34,570 --> 00:28:30,770
object to my left

643
00:28:36,250 --> 00:28:34,580
I thought it was a turnover car when I

644
00:28:39,580 --> 00:28:36,260
got up on top of the Miss out there I

645
00:28:42,250 --> 00:28:39,590
looked down and I seen this big white

646
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:42,260
object on the ground I could see

647
00:28:46,450 --> 00:28:44,570
something around the crafter I could see

648
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:46,460
some figures look like they were walking

649
00:28:52,300 --> 00:28:49,610
around with that they make it seem like

650
00:28:55,140 --> 00:28:52,310
he saw these people the entire time on

651
00:28:59,380 --> 00:28:55,150
the show when in fact he actually didn't

652
00:29:01,000 --> 00:28:59,390
our research when we did the episode on

653
00:29:03,190 --> 00:29:01,010
Lonnie Zamora showed that he only saw

654
00:29:05,940 --> 00:29:03,200
these like humanoid figures for probably

655
00:29:10,750 --> 00:29:05,950
about three or four seconds so I did

656
00:29:12,910 --> 00:29:10,760
good work yeah in real time he lost

657
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:12,920
sight of them for about 35 to 40 seconds

658
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:16,970
and he comes around this clearing and he

659
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:20,450
could see not a car but what looks like

660
00:29:28,390 --> 00:29:23,690
an egg-shaped object suspended on legs

661
00:29:32,020 --> 00:29:28,400
sitting in this irori oh and he stops he

662
00:29:36,220 --> 00:29:32,030
gets out he looks at it and then all of

663
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:36,230
a sudden he hears this it's like a low

664
00:29:40,750 --> 00:29:37,850
pitched sound that goes to a

665
00:29:43,420 --> 00:29:40,760
high-pitched sound here's a roaring

666
00:29:45,850 --> 00:29:43,430
sound that begins then and he sees this

667
00:29:49,660 --> 00:29:45,860
blue flames shoot up from underneath

668
00:29:51,310 --> 00:29:49,670
this object it lifts up and it doesn't

669
00:29:55,420 --> 00:29:51,320
lift up very high in the air about

670
00:29:57,820 --> 00:29:55,430
twenty feet but he's looking at it from

671
00:30:00,250 --> 00:29:57,830
the safety of being behind his car

672
00:30:04,510 --> 00:30:00,260
essentially and he watches it kind of

673
00:30:07,150 --> 00:30:04,520
slowly float away like barely clears

674
00:30:10,030 --> 00:30:07,160
this neighbor this mayor's dynamite

675
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:10,040
Shack and then just speeds off into the

676
00:30:15,100 --> 00:30:12,650
desert at first you know after I got to

677
00:30:18,210 --> 00:30:15,110
my senses I said did I see it or didn't

678
00:30:23,860 --> 00:30:18,220
I you know oh what happened you know and

679
00:30:27,670 --> 00:30:23,870
that's it and from that point he radios

680
00:30:31,150 --> 00:30:27,680
a deputy Sam Chavez who come out they

681
00:30:33,940 --> 00:30:31,160
inspect the landing site they find these

682
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:33,950
bushes that are singeing but when they

683
00:30:36,790 --> 00:30:35,930
go and they touch them they're actually

684
00:30:40,510 --> 00:30:36,800
cold to the touch

685
00:30:43,060 --> 00:30:40,520
they also find circular indentations in

686
00:30:44,330 --> 00:30:43,070
the ground and a couple other burnt

687
00:30:47,390 --> 00:30:44,340
areas

688
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:47,400
there's a few things I just want to

689
00:30:53,210 --> 00:30:50,130
interject here Rob in terms of how

690
00:30:57,620 --> 00:30:53,220
detail miss wow I almost said mysteries

691
00:31:02,080 --> 00:30:57,630
decoded Jesus bad wrong show

692
00:31:06,350 --> 00:31:02,090
unsolved mysteries how they covered the

693
00:31:06,860 --> 00:31:06,360
the craft itself it looked so good first

694
00:31:09,140 --> 00:31:06,870
of all

695
00:31:12,050 --> 00:31:09,150
yes the special effects were amazing and

696
00:31:14,660 --> 00:31:12,060
second when he first gets sight of this

697
00:31:16,250 --> 00:31:14,670
egg shaped craft you can see the

698
00:31:18,650 --> 00:31:16,260
reflection of the craft in his

699
00:31:21,650 --> 00:31:18,660
sunglasses like dude they went all out

700
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:21,660
for this one this is probably the best

701
00:31:28,610 --> 00:31:25,290
example of when unsolved mysteries

702
00:31:31,550 --> 00:31:28,620
really puts their dollars into making a

703
00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:31,560
story really good because if you look at

704
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:34,170
some of the earlier ones dear God the

705
00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:36,570
CGI was terrible we'll get into some of

706
00:31:42,710 --> 00:31:39,090
those but like this is probably the best

707
00:31:46,010 --> 00:31:42,720
example of a UFO it even has the

708
00:31:47,570 --> 00:31:46,020
insignia that he claims to have seen on

709
00:31:49,820 --> 00:31:47,580
the side of this thing and it kind of

710
00:31:52,700 --> 00:31:49,830
just like looks like a beat-up egg just

711
00:31:55,100 --> 00:31:52,710
like hovering in the air but it doesn't

712
00:31:58,460 --> 00:31:55,110
look hokey it looks kind of real and

713
00:32:00,740 --> 00:31:58,470
then yeah it speeds off but like the guy

714
00:32:03,890 --> 00:32:00,750
that they got to play Zamora places part

715
00:32:06,710 --> 00:32:03,900
you know perfectly well and I I what I

716
00:32:08,540 --> 00:32:06,720
love too is the interview segments they

717
00:32:10,610 --> 00:32:08,550
interview all these people against the

718
00:32:12,140 --> 00:32:10,620
backdrop of the desert which just you

719
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:12,150
know adds it a little more authenticity

720
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:16,530
to it but yeah this definitely the best

721
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:20,490
example of UFOs in unsolved mysteries

722
00:32:24,500 --> 00:32:22,290
absolutely I couldn't agree with you

723
00:32:26,210 --> 00:32:24,510
more and I mean yeah like you mentioned

724
00:32:29,690 --> 00:32:26,220
the symbol now I know this is something

725
00:32:32,180 --> 00:32:29,700
you've looked into a lot as well now in

726
00:32:33,770 --> 00:32:32,190
the episode they have they described it

727
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:33,780
as a vertical arrow with a horizontal

728
00:32:38,900 --> 00:32:35,970
line beneath it and a crescent-shaped

729
00:32:41,330 --> 00:32:38,910
line above it no I know this episode is

730
00:32:42,950 --> 00:32:41,340
pretty old and there's been some you

731
00:32:44,900 --> 00:32:42,960
know debate on what the actual symbol

732
00:32:47,180 --> 00:32:44,910
was on this thing well how do you think

733
00:32:49,580 --> 00:32:47,190
they did with that Rob is that what you

734
00:32:54,410 --> 00:32:49,590
know Lonnie he says was on there the

735
00:32:57,560 --> 00:32:54,420
thing is is that in the research that we

736
00:32:58,190 --> 00:32:57,570
found there was an individual by the

737
00:33:00,110 --> 00:32:58,200
name of

738
00:33:02,810 --> 00:33:00,120
captain moody I think he was a captain

739
00:33:07,250 --> 00:33:02,820
but he was a member of Project Blue Book

740
00:33:10,370 --> 00:33:07,260
and at the time mysteriously he was at

741
00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:10,380
White Sands Missile Range working on a

742
00:33:15,530 --> 00:33:13,050
project called Project cloud gap now a

743
00:33:18,460 --> 00:33:15,540
project cloud gap was ruled out in the

744
00:33:21,490 --> 00:33:18,470
initial reports as being responsible for

745
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:21,500
the siting here and in fact they went

746
00:33:27,740 --> 00:33:25,050
the project Bluebook folks went into

747
00:33:30,050 --> 00:33:27,750
detail trying to figure out well is this

748
00:33:32,150 --> 00:33:30,060
a lunar lander that was being tested out

749
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:32,160
that just managed to fly into the Sirois

750
00:33:36,980 --> 00:33:35,370
oh and there was 11 allegedly 11 of them

751
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:36,990
in production at the time and none of

752
00:33:43,610 --> 00:33:40,370
them matched the description but Moody

753
00:33:46,660 --> 00:33:43,620
was kind of a spearhead in this

754
00:33:49,550 --> 00:33:46,670
investigation early on like it wasn't

755
00:33:51,950 --> 00:33:49,560
until a few days later that Blue Book

756
00:33:53,930 --> 00:33:51,960
actually took over the investigation it

757
00:33:57,020 --> 00:33:53,940
started with the FBI who wasn't also

758
00:34:00,620 --> 00:33:57,030
mysteriously in town that day doing

759
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:00,630
something else but one of the rumors and

760
00:34:07,340 --> 00:34:02,730
one of the things that we think he did

761
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:07,350
was he told zomora to lie about the

762
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:10,770
symbol and basically that if he did that

763
00:34:14,690 --> 00:34:12,570
we would know if there were other

764
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:14,700
eyewitnesses that came forward what the

765
00:34:20,620 --> 00:34:18,570
real symbol was so one possibility is is

766
00:34:22,820 --> 00:34:20,630
that the symbol that he drew is

767
00:34:25,820 --> 00:34:22,830
intentionally the wrong symbol to throw

768
00:34:27,230 --> 00:34:25,830
people off to you know for any other

769
00:34:30,140 --> 00:34:27,240
additional eye but this is that would

770
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:30,150
come forward the other symbol and what

771
00:34:36,650 --> 00:34:32,850
may it be the actual real symbol looks

772
00:34:39,350 --> 00:34:36,660
like an A with three horizontal lines

773
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:39,360
running through it interesting okay all

774
00:34:44,030 --> 00:34:41,130
right I can I can kind of say the logic

775
00:34:46,310 --> 00:34:44,040
behind that you did mention other

776
00:34:48,380 --> 00:34:46,320
witnesses and we did get a sense of that

777
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:48,390
in this episode which is pretty cool

778
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:51,090
they had this this dude Jim grinder who

779
00:34:56,150 --> 00:34:53,970
was 13 at the time he was traveling with

780
00:34:59,060 --> 00:34:56,160
his family and they stopped at a gas

781
00:35:01,370 --> 00:34:59,070
station and they tell the gas station

782
00:35:03,380 --> 00:35:01,380
attendant like what what do you got

783
00:35:06,230 --> 00:35:03,390
going on in your town here this thing

784
00:35:08,930 --> 00:35:06,240
this oval-shaped thing like passed right

785
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:08,940
over the hood of our car I mean if this

786
00:35:12,020 --> 00:35:11,610
is true if this is another testimony to

787
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:12,030
the event

788
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:13,290
at least we now know it doesn't just

789
00:35:18,110 --> 00:35:15,530
rest on the shoulders of Lonnie Zamora

790
00:35:19,730 --> 00:35:18,120
there was that eyewitness and I think

791
00:35:21,410 --> 00:35:19,740
there was a there might have been

792
00:35:25,220 --> 00:35:21,420
another eyewitness that claimed to have

793
00:35:28,250 --> 00:35:25,230
seen it too but yeah it lends a little

794
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:28,260
more credibility I mean Jim grinder was

795
00:35:32,720 --> 00:35:30,570
a teenager working at his parents gas

796
00:35:35,450 --> 00:35:32,730
station so it's a great it's great story

797
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:35,460
but that has actually been one

798
00:35:40,430 --> 00:35:38,610
eyewitness account that has been kind of

799
00:35:42,140 --> 00:35:40,440
bolstered and it's one that is

800
00:35:44,750 --> 00:35:42,150
considered trustworthy when it comes to

801
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:44,760
this case so yeah it's it's good that's

802
00:35:49,100 --> 00:35:47,010
somebody else seemed to have witnessed

803
00:35:52,850 --> 00:35:49,110
it and they kind of attested to the fact

804
00:35:54,980 --> 00:35:52,860
that they saw Lonnie Zamora or they they

805
00:35:57,620 --> 00:35:54,990
claim to see a cop you know running in

806
00:35:59,690 --> 00:35:57,630
pursuit of it so yeah yeah if we can

807
00:36:03,260 --> 00:35:59,700
connect those dots you know game over

808
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:03,270
man but well let's move back to the the

809
00:36:07,910 --> 00:36:05,610
I guess we could say the military

810
00:36:10,130 --> 00:36:07,920
investigation with this so within 90

811
00:36:11,870 --> 00:36:10,140
minutes of the incident army officials

812
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:11,880
from White Sands Missile Range show up

813
00:36:17,410 --> 00:36:14,850
headed by captain Richard T holder who

814
00:36:20,930 --> 00:36:17,420
they actually got on camera as well

815
00:36:22,250 --> 00:36:20,940
again go unsolved mysteries like just

816
00:36:24,410 --> 00:36:22,260
bringing out the big guns with these

817
00:36:26,810 --> 00:36:24,420
things my first impression was that it

818
00:36:29,110 --> 00:36:26,820
was something from the range that needed

819
00:36:32,750 --> 00:36:29,120
possible health you know first aid

820
00:36:35,300 --> 00:36:32,760
attention are at best security the more

821
00:36:38,300 --> 00:36:35,310
I got into it the less convinced I was

822
00:36:40,610 --> 00:36:38,310
that that was a case to try to find out

823
00:36:43,490 --> 00:36:40,620
if we could see any evidence of anything

824
00:36:45,380 --> 00:36:43,500
it would make us think it was a hoax we

825
00:36:47,390 --> 00:36:45,390
found nothing you know there's people

826
00:36:50,180 --> 00:36:47,400
that gathered around the site at this

827
00:36:52,130 --> 00:36:50,190
point and and this is interesting we get

828
00:36:53,930 --> 00:36:52,140
a reenactment of the captain he goes

829
00:36:56,420 --> 00:36:53,940
through a branch on a scorched tree and

830
00:36:59,050 --> 00:36:56,430
literally tastes it and that was the

831
00:37:10,760 --> 00:36:59,060
extent of the investigation he's like

832
00:37:13,690 --> 00:37:10,770
nope Court in this area one little kid

833
00:37:17,630 --> 00:37:13,700
was apparently selling like popcorn

834
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:17,640
I'm so happy you saw that too okay what

835
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:21,690
the hell was up with that I mean get

836
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:23,610
your peanuts getcha popcorn

837
00:37:30,290 --> 00:37:25,410
what that was just kid doing out

838
00:37:32,720 --> 00:37:30,300
right like do we need this type of

839
00:37:36,020 --> 00:37:32,730
concession stand out of it out of the

840
00:37:38,540 --> 00:37:36,030
UFO site like maybe there's a loss Tech

841
00:37:41,090 --> 00:37:38,550
epic economic opportunity there I'm not

842
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:41,100
exactly sure but I feel like I feel a

843
00:37:44,060 --> 00:37:43,290
little bad that this kid was shut down I

844
00:37:46,970 --> 00:37:44,070
know

845
00:37:50,240 --> 00:37:46,980
yo that is an entreprenuer I mean I will

846
00:37:52,250 --> 00:37:50,250
tell you this man whenever like not to

847
00:37:54,350 --> 00:37:52,260
get dark or anything but when 9/11

848
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:54,360
happened like the next day there were

849
00:37:58,220 --> 00:37:55,770
people on the streets selling t-shirts

850
00:38:01,190 --> 00:37:58,230
you know like right and stuff like that

851
00:38:03,950 --> 00:38:01,200
so I mean that stuff happens I just what

852
00:38:05,540 --> 00:38:03,960
an easter egg in this episode like what

853
00:38:08,450 --> 00:38:05,550
does this kid doing in the middle of the

854
00:38:12,140 --> 00:38:08,460
desert at a UFO site Hawking cigarettes

855
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:12,150
or popcorn or something man

856
00:38:17,090 --> 00:38:14,370
man I'm glad you caught that too let's

857
00:38:19,390 --> 00:38:17,100
see well the Army captain that we

858
00:38:23,240 --> 00:38:19,400
mentioned he backs up Lonnie Zamora

859
00:38:25,340 --> 00:38:23,250
everything we saw seemed to support the

860
00:38:27,860 --> 00:38:25,350
story that officers are moral recounted

861
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:27,870
my impression of talking to him was that

862
00:38:32,570 --> 00:38:29,970
he was mystified he wanted an

863
00:38:35,090 --> 00:38:32,580
explanation nothing gave me the

864
00:38:38,090 --> 00:38:35,100
slightest hint that he did this as a

865
00:38:39,740 --> 00:38:38,100
hoax or cooked it up for fame or fortune

866
00:38:42,610 --> 00:38:39,750
that's the thing is like everybody

867
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:42,620
that's talking about this case is like I

868
00:38:47,690 --> 00:38:45,690
immediately thought it was this and then

869
00:38:50,450 --> 00:38:47,700
when I found that it wasn't this I was

870
00:38:52,490 --> 00:38:50,460
like well he experienced something I

871
00:38:54,980 --> 00:38:52,500
just don't know what it is it doesn't

872
00:38:57,670 --> 00:38:54,990
make any sense and I'm like that's the

873
00:39:02,470 --> 00:38:57,680
perfect encapsulation of like any

874
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:02,480
legitimate UFO encounter it's just

875
00:39:08,810 --> 00:39:05,490
something happened but we have no

876
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:08,820
[\h__\h] clue and I mean this is what's

877
00:39:14,330 --> 00:39:11,010
kind of heartbreaking we know this this

878
00:39:16,550 --> 00:39:14,340
event kind of really affected Zamora and

879
00:39:18,710 --> 00:39:16,560
his career and you know he was getting

880
00:39:20,870 --> 00:39:18,720
hounded by reporters after this from all

881
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:20,880
over the world he was sick of talking

882
00:39:27,110 --> 00:39:23,610
about it he didn't want to be known for

883
00:39:30,260 --> 00:39:27,120
this and kind of drove him to retirement

884
00:39:33,260 --> 00:39:30,270
if I am remembering correctly yeah he

885
00:39:36,740 --> 00:39:33,270
ended up retiring and running a waste

886
00:39:38,420 --> 00:39:36,750
treatment plant they stopped me all over

887
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:38,430
want to know this wanted to know that

888
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:41,010
and then I got a phone call from all

889
00:39:49,010 --> 00:39:45,650
over the world no I was getting you know

890
00:39:51,110 --> 00:39:49,020
disgusted with it then there you go hey

891
00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:51,120
we all have a second life in us

892
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:53,490
somewhere so you know he probably does

893
00:39:58,550 --> 00:39:56,490
regret following that speeder out there

894
00:39:59,000 --> 00:39:58,560
or not speeder hasn't looked like in the

895
00:40:02,180 --> 00:39:59,010
show

896
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:02,190
but um yeah man oh but we also got like

897
00:40:06,860 --> 00:40:04,050
you said blue book came out we get

898
00:40:09,470 --> 00:40:06,870
probably our first ever televised

899
00:40:12,350 --> 00:40:09,480
reenactment of J Allen Hynek before

900
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:12,360
hating a Gillian there was this actor on

901
00:40:16,130 --> 00:40:14,610
unsolved mysteries and I'm not counting

902
00:40:20,270 --> 00:40:16,140
Close Encounters because he was not

903
00:40:21,830 --> 00:40:20,280
himself in that yeah I remember oh man

904
00:40:24,410 --> 00:40:21,840
this is yeah this is an interesting

905
00:40:26,060 --> 00:40:24,420
memory that I have after watching this

906
00:40:29,090 --> 00:40:26,070
cuz like on top mysteries is like a

907
00:40:31,010 --> 00:40:29,100
family thing for us so it was usually on

908
00:40:33,350 --> 00:40:31,020
a Friday night so we the family would

909
00:40:36,710 --> 00:40:33,360
gather around watch it I think on saw

910
00:40:38,210 --> 00:40:36,720
our rescue 911 was on Tuesday nights if

911
00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:38,220
I remember correctly but you're right

912
00:40:41,660 --> 00:40:38,730
yep

913
00:40:44,930 --> 00:40:41,670
on Fridays we would watch it and I

914
00:40:46,690 --> 00:40:44,940
remember this case affected me a [\h__\h]

915
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:46,700
ton at the time because it was just like

916
00:40:52,430 --> 00:40:50,610
this is a cop he [\h__\h] saw this [\h__\h]

917
00:40:54,110 --> 00:40:52,440
everybody's attesting to the fact that

918
00:40:57,290 --> 00:40:54,120
he saw something that they can't explain

919
00:40:59,600 --> 00:40:57,300
even to this date they can't [\h__\h]

920
00:41:01,580 --> 00:40:59,610
explain it but like we were doing this

921
00:41:04,730 --> 00:41:01,590
project in middle school and I think it

922
00:41:07,930 --> 00:41:04,740
was in sixth grade at the time sixth or

923
00:41:12,770 --> 00:41:07,940
seventh grade and in our English class

924
00:41:14,540 --> 00:41:12,780
we were doing this project that where we

925
00:41:16,940 --> 00:41:14,550
were like kind of breaking apart the

926
00:41:19,970 --> 00:41:16,950
lyrics if we didn't start the fire and

927
00:41:22,430 --> 00:41:19,980
just like and doing presentations about

928
00:41:24,740 --> 00:41:22,440
all of the [\h__\h] that was like in there

929
00:41:26,690 --> 00:41:24,750
so like you know it was pretty much kind

930
00:41:29,150 --> 00:41:26,700
of broken down by decades so the teacher

931
00:41:31,250 --> 00:41:29,160
gave us like okay you you go research

932
00:41:34,610 --> 00:41:31,260
this by the decade and that by the

933
00:41:37,100 --> 00:41:34,620
decade but he the other part of the

934
00:41:40,250 --> 00:41:37,110
project was well what would we add to it

935
00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:40,260
you know what could we replace some of

936
00:41:44,870 --> 00:41:42,090
the lyrics with and I distinctly

937
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:44,880
remember because like the the computer

938
00:41:49,860 --> 00:41:48,050
system that we had at the time was new I

939
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:49,870
went to the search and

940
00:41:54,450 --> 00:41:52,450
and I typed in the [\h__\h] name J Allen

941
00:41:56,340 --> 00:41:54,460
Hynek and I'm like it never came back

942
00:41:59,160 --> 00:41:56,350
with anything but I'm just like that

943
00:42:01,650 --> 00:41:59,170
name never left my consciousness after

944
00:42:03,300 --> 00:42:01,660
that I don't I I really to this day I

945
00:42:05,940 --> 00:42:03,310
can't fully explain what it is about

946
00:42:09,720 --> 00:42:05,950
this case but it was just like it's just

947
00:42:11,790 --> 00:42:09,730
it rocked my young adolescent mind we

948
00:42:14,490 --> 00:42:11,800
all have that case man and mine is

949
00:42:17,250 --> 00:42:14,500
coming up in a little bit here yeah but

950
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:17,260
yeah so yeah Socorro is one of the best

951
00:42:22,650 --> 00:42:19,810
cases out there and has genuinely

952
00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:22,660
mystified even the heart most hardened

953
00:42:28,110 --> 00:42:26,050
of skeptics so and that has a lot to do

954
00:42:30,330 --> 00:42:28,120
with the credibility of the witnesses

955
00:42:32,850 --> 00:42:30,340
which is you know big with these things

956
00:42:35,550 --> 00:42:32,860
um and that couldn't be more true than

957
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:35,560
our next one and this this is an

958
00:42:42,510 --> 00:42:38,290
interesting case we have Falcon Lake May

959
00:42:46,650 --> 00:42:42,520
20th 1967 so we are moving over to

960
00:42:49,470 --> 00:42:46,660
Canada Manitoba by his own admission

961
00:42:52,610 --> 00:42:49,480
Stephen michalak is an ordinary man who

962
00:42:54,900 --> 00:42:52,620
leads an ordinary life but in 1967

963
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:54,910
michalak claims that his life was turned

964
00:43:00,290 --> 00:42:57,130
upside down when he had an extraordinary

965
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:00,300
encounter with a mysterious flying craft

966
00:43:07,530 --> 00:43:03,970
we get you know nature loving bird

967
00:43:09,030 --> 00:43:07,540
loving Stephen Michalak right at the

968
00:43:10,890 --> 00:43:09,040
start of this one which was still

969
00:43:13,650 --> 00:43:10,900
refreshing I wasn't expecting to see him

970
00:43:14,940 --> 00:43:13,660
on camera for this case so um yeah yeah

971
00:43:20,940 --> 00:43:14,950
did you know anything about this case

972
00:43:23,700 --> 00:43:20,950
Rob prior to to this episode yeah man

973
00:43:25,710 --> 00:43:23,710
like Stephen Miculek is probably all

974
00:43:27,420 --> 00:43:25,720
sorry Stefan Michalak because they call

975
00:43:29,180 --> 00:43:27,430
him Stephen to michalak in the in the

976
00:43:33,510 --> 00:43:29,190
episode his name is Stefan Michalak

977
00:43:38,130 --> 00:43:33,520
Schettino yeah he's from Poland so he's

978
00:43:41,850 --> 00:43:38,140
probably one of the most interesting UFO

979
00:43:43,860 --> 00:43:41,860
witnesses that I've you know ever

980
00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:43,870
researched or anything like that but he

981
00:43:50,370 --> 00:43:47,890
was a he was an amateur geologist you

982
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:50,380
know he did it on and on the weekends

983
00:43:54,990 --> 00:43:53,050
and basically what he would do is you go

984
00:43:57,630 --> 00:43:55,000
into the Manitoba wilderness and he'd

985
00:43:59,550 --> 00:43:57,640
look for quartz veins because quartz

986
00:44:02,730 --> 00:43:59,560
veins would often lead to silver

987
00:44:03,630 --> 00:44:02,740
deposits so this was his amateur hobby

988
00:44:08,430 --> 00:44:03,640
in

989
00:44:10,500 --> 00:44:08,440
1967 May 20th 1967 he decided to go out

990
00:44:12,420 --> 00:44:10,510
into the wilderness you know he told his

991
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:12,430
family see I'm going to look for silver

992
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:15,970
and yeah he goes up the night before and

993
00:44:24,030 --> 00:44:19,330
he sets out early the next day to go and

994
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:24,040
and look and shortly before I want to

995
00:44:29,100 --> 00:44:26,890
say is like 9 o'clock that morning he

996
00:44:31,650 --> 00:44:29,110
finds a quartz vein and you know he's

997
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:31,660
just going to town going to town he has

998
00:44:38,430 --> 00:44:34,090
lunch and then gets back at it in a few

999
00:44:40,140 --> 00:44:38,440
minutes after lunch he notices that

1000
00:44:44,700 --> 00:44:40,150
there's some geese that are just like

1001
00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:44,710
going nuts no and he he looks over at

1002
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:46,570
him to see what the heck startled him

1003
00:44:50,810 --> 00:44:48,210
and he looks up and he sees these two

1004
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:50,820
what he describes as cigar-shaped

1005
00:44:56,340 --> 00:44:53,410
objects with a bump on the top of them

1006
00:44:59,160 --> 00:44:56,350
and one of them flies off but one of

1007
00:45:08,780 --> 00:44:59,170
them starts to come down closer to where

1008
00:45:14,490 --> 00:45:12,480
this is probably in terms of the UFO

1009
00:45:17,690 --> 00:45:14,500
coverage on unsolved mysteries this was

1010
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:17,700
probably the worst CGI I can admit that

1011
00:45:27,690 --> 00:45:24,370
yeah and this UFO lands on this rock

1012
00:45:31,920 --> 00:45:27,700
field near where Stefan Michalak

1013
00:45:33,660 --> 00:45:31,930
is and the general shape of it that they

1014
00:45:35,580 --> 00:45:33,670
got on the show is correct

1015
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:35,590
that's exactly pretty much what he saw

1016
00:45:43,710 --> 00:45:40,690
so he he goes up to it and he thinks at

1017
00:45:46,950 --> 00:45:43,720
first that this is an American

1018
00:45:48,720 --> 00:45:46,960
experimental craft and it's having some

1019
00:45:51,240 --> 00:45:48,730
kind of troubles so he goes up to the

1020
00:46:00,210 --> 00:45:51,250
craft that he says hello there Yankee

1021
00:46:00,980 --> 00:46:00,220
boys thinking of us I said okay Yankee

1022
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:00,990
boys

1023
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:03,490
thank you thanks to me you are in

1024
00:46:09,110 --> 00:46:05,010
terrible

1025
00:46:11,050 --> 00:46:09,120
you got troubles I'll help you come on

1026
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:11,060
out we'll see what we could do about it

1027
00:46:17,570 --> 00:46:13,890
and when he doesn't get a response in

1028
00:46:23,150 --> 00:46:17,580
English she starts talking in German

1029
00:46:26,300 --> 00:46:23,160
Russian polish Italian there are a bunch

1030
00:46:28,490 --> 00:46:26,310
of languages that he knew died when his

1031
00:46:41,410 --> 00:46:28,500
english received no response Stephen

1032
00:46:46,130 --> 00:46:41,420
tried Russian then polish alistair and

1033
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:46,140
finally german noise expectancy deutsche

1034
00:46:54,529 --> 00:46:51,620
Home Ec head out secret the husband in

1035
00:46:58,970 --> 00:46:54,539
it and he just like yelled it at this

1036
00:47:03,529 --> 00:46:58,980
[\h__\h] UFO so a door on this thing it

1037
00:47:05,450 --> 00:47:03,539
just opens up like he just he said it

1038
00:47:08,210 --> 00:47:05,460
like kind of just like slid open to the

1039
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:08,220
side and he kind of approached his up

1040
00:47:12,559 --> 00:47:10,770
close to it he has welders goggles on

1041
00:47:16,460 --> 00:47:12,569
he's a welder by trade

1042
00:47:18,710 --> 00:47:16,470
he's a an industrial mechanic and he

1043
00:47:20,420 --> 00:47:18,720
puts down the Viners visor to look into

1044
00:47:23,870 --> 00:47:20,430
this thing and the cgi inside this

1045
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:23,880
goddamn craft it's terrible and I think

1046
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:26,010
he even admits at least his son does

1047
00:47:30,710 --> 00:47:28,650
later on in a book that his son helped

1048
00:47:32,900 --> 00:47:30,720
co-write that like they kind of just

1049
00:47:34,730 --> 00:47:32,910
made that up what was in the craft he

1050
00:47:37,339 --> 00:47:34,740
didn't really actually see too much

1051
00:47:39,230 --> 00:47:37,349
inside of it from what I remember no no

1052
00:47:40,910 --> 00:47:39,240
because it was like a you know really

1053
00:47:42,980 --> 00:47:40,920
bright light coming from inside but he

1054
00:47:44,990 --> 00:47:42,990
described hearing what he thought were

1055
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:45,000
voices and the way that he does it in

1056
00:47:54,799 --> 00:47:47,490
the show is so [\h__\h] great I loved did

1057
00:47:59,210 --> 00:47:54,809
was it shrink Ito clica like a kids in

1058
00:48:01,579 --> 00:47:59,220
problem or something okay well while

1059
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:01,589
you're on that Rob dude this guy is like

1060
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:05,490
he is a performer you know he's he's a

1061
00:48:09,769 --> 00:48:07,770
good storyteller so like having the

1062
00:48:12,260 --> 00:48:09,779
actual witness on there and having him

1063
00:48:14,059 --> 00:48:12,270
be that engaging I think only adds to

1064
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:14,069
the story and some people might think

1065
00:48:19,250 --> 00:48:16,410
that's a bad thing but for me I'm like

1066
00:48:22,010 --> 00:48:19,260
damn like this dude is passionate about

1067
00:48:24,890 --> 00:48:22,020
what he saw and like he is reliving it

1068
00:48:27,319 --> 00:48:24,900
as he's selling this oh yeah you can

1069
00:48:29,839 --> 00:48:27,329
catch him like when he's describing

1070
00:48:31,579 --> 00:48:29,849
looking up at it for the first time and

1071
00:48:34,460 --> 00:48:31,589
he's on camera

1072
00:48:37,339 --> 00:48:34,470
describing it he's looking up as if he's

1073
00:48:40,339 --> 00:48:37,349
reliving it at the time and like he is

1074
00:48:43,670 --> 00:48:40,349
he's very passionate about the story and

1075
00:48:46,069 --> 00:48:43,680
it's something that carries on even

1076
00:48:49,069 --> 00:48:46,079
after the initial encounter but like

1077
00:48:51,799 --> 00:48:49,079
after you know he kind of peers in a

1078
00:48:54,829 --> 00:48:51,809
little bit the door on the craft closes

1079
00:48:59,089 --> 00:48:54,839
and it kind of lifts up a little bit and

1080
00:49:02,870 --> 00:48:59,099
it rotates and in front of him is this

1081
00:49:03,530 --> 00:49:02,880
like grid of it looks like an exhaust

1082
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:03,540
grid

1083
00:49:12,260 --> 00:49:07,410
yeah porthole zomos yeah yeah yeah he is

1084
00:49:14,900 --> 00:49:12,270
shot in the chest with hot gas and it

1085
00:49:17,750 --> 00:49:14,910
immediately catches his shirt on fire to

1086
00:49:21,710 --> 00:49:17,760
which he rips it off and and stuff like

1087
00:49:23,750 --> 00:49:21,720
and and to make the point he this craft

1088
00:49:26,300 --> 00:49:23,760
was landed on this rock for

1089
00:49:28,220 --> 00:49:26,310
approximately 30 minutes so he's

1090
00:49:30,470 --> 00:49:28,230
actually able to sketch this thing out

1091
00:49:33,950 --> 00:49:30,480
in his notebook before he like even

1092
00:49:37,820 --> 00:49:33,960
approach the damn thing but you know he

1093
00:49:40,940 --> 00:49:37,830
starts to wander out and then I decide

1094
00:49:44,780 --> 00:49:40,950
to say now is the time for me to buzz

1095
00:49:49,610 --> 00:49:44,790
off from here go out so I started going

1096
00:49:52,100 --> 00:49:49,620
he he's like half naked kind of through

1097
00:49:54,230 --> 00:49:52,110
the woods yeah and like I just want to

1098
00:49:57,110 --> 00:49:54,240
know that the guy that is stumbling in

1099
00:49:58,990 --> 00:49:57,120
this episode has clearly never stumbled

1100
00:50:01,910 --> 00:49:59,000
a day in his life you can [\h__\h] tell

1101
00:50:10,820 --> 00:50:01,920
yeah he didn't really get the directors

1102
00:50:12,620 --> 00:50:10,830
note on how to stumble correctly what's

1103
00:50:14,150 --> 00:50:12,630
up guys Ryan Sprague here and I'm just

1104
00:50:16,580 --> 00:50:14,160
dropping in to remind you about our

1105
00:50:18,890 --> 00:50:16,590
patreon campaign somewhere in the skies

1106
00:50:20,630 --> 00:50:18,900
is always free to consume but it's not

1107
00:50:23,240 --> 00:50:20,640
free to create so if you want to help

1108
00:50:25,970 --> 00:50:23,250
the show on a monthly basis we have tons

1109
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:25,980
of rewards for you in return including

1110
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:28,530
shout outs on the show and website bonus

1111
00:50:32,810 --> 00:50:32,010
content and episodes and free merch want

1112
00:50:35,270 --> 00:50:32,820
to be my guest

1113
00:50:37,190 --> 00:50:35,280
or pick a topic for the show you can do

1114
00:50:39,140 --> 00:50:37,200
that too so if you'd like to learn more

1115
00:50:42,740 --> 00:50:39,150
and to help support the show visit

1116
00:50:49,670 --> 00:50:42,750
patreon.com slash summer scouts thank

1117
00:50:54,140 --> 00:50:52,339
well before we we get to the next step

1118
00:50:56,390 --> 00:50:54,150
Rob I have to say I don't mean to laugh

1119
00:50:59,390 --> 00:50:56,400
at this guy and getting caught on fire

1120
00:51:03,980 --> 00:50:59,400
but the way they did it in the show just

1121
00:51:06,019 --> 00:51:03,990
so comically over-the-top I had to stop

1122
00:51:09,380 --> 00:51:06,029
the episode because I was laughing so

1123
00:51:11,900 --> 00:51:09,390
hard but that being said like if if that

1124
00:51:16,309 --> 00:51:11,910
actually happened to Jamaica like if

1125
00:51:19,069 --> 00:51:16,319
that is terrible yeah it is it's one of

1126
00:51:20,839 --> 00:51:19,079
the best experiences did you ever want

1127
00:51:26,150 --> 00:51:20,849
but yeah it is kind of comical in the

1128
00:51:29,029 --> 00:51:26,160
way that it happens but yeah he he

1129
00:51:32,450 --> 00:51:29,039
essentially stumbles to his pack to find

1130
00:51:34,339 --> 00:51:32,460
his compass to figure out how to get

1131
00:51:36,200 --> 00:51:34,349
back to the road because he needs

1132
00:51:39,980 --> 00:51:36,210
medical assistance he's in a lot of pain

1133
00:51:42,230 --> 00:51:39,990
he's nauseous and he finds that his

1134
00:51:44,930 --> 00:51:42,240
compass is just spinning wildly he

1135
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:44,940
doesn't know why so it takes him a

1136
00:51:48,289 --> 00:51:46,170
little while I think it takes him like

1137
00:51:51,950 --> 00:51:48,299
an hour but he finally stumbles back to

1138
00:51:54,170 --> 00:51:51,960
the road and what they don't tell you in

1139
00:51:57,319 --> 00:51:54,180
the show is that there's a car that

1140
00:51:59,749 --> 00:51:57,329
passes him and he tries to flag it down

1141
00:52:04,009 --> 00:51:59,759
and initially just drives by and then it

1142
00:52:07,729 --> 00:52:04,019
comes back and it's an RCMP officer okay

1143
00:52:11,029 --> 00:52:07,739
and he explains what happened to him he

1144
00:52:12,979 --> 00:52:11,039
explains that a UFO [\h__\h] shot him in

1145
00:52:15,140 --> 00:52:12,989
the chest with some gas basically UFO

1146
00:52:18,140 --> 00:52:15,150
farted on this guy because he smelled

1147
00:52:20,479 --> 00:52:18,150
like sulfur so we don't you know this

1148
00:52:22,910 --> 00:52:20,489
UFO farted on them it's disrespectful

1149
00:52:24,979 --> 00:52:22,920
UFO should not be farting on people it's

1150
00:52:26,539 --> 00:52:24,989
a real problem in this case and I hope

1151
00:52:31,690 --> 00:52:26,549
it never happened to anybody else but

1152
00:52:35,930 --> 00:52:31,700
yeah it's a a cosmic crop dust yeah and

1153
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:35,940
this RCMP officer lisses to a story and

1154
00:52:45,220 --> 00:52:40,170
he turns to him and he says sorry I have

1155
00:52:53,839 --> 00:52:50,900
the original like articles that Chris

1156
00:52:57,319 --> 00:52:53,849
Bukowski actually wrote for Flying

1157
00:52:59,870 --> 00:52:57,329
Saucer review and for nycap there's PDF

1158
00:53:02,569 --> 00:52:59,880
copies available out there but the

1159
00:53:03,380 --> 00:53:02,579
report is just wild but yeah he claims

1160
00:53:05,720 --> 00:53:03,390
that's what the

1161
00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:05,730
CMP officer told him you need drove off

1162
00:53:12,470 --> 00:53:10,410
and it took Miculek somewhere in the

1163
00:53:14,930 --> 00:53:12,480
neighborhood of four hours to stumble

1164
00:53:16,700 --> 00:53:14,940
back into town he was doing his best to

1165
00:53:18,230 --> 00:53:16,710
kind of keep his distance from people

1166
00:53:19,910 --> 00:53:18,240
because he thought he was like

1167
00:53:22,759 --> 00:53:19,920
radioactive or something like that but

1168
00:53:25,329 --> 00:53:22,769
he ultimately buys a bus ticket to go

1169
00:53:29,620 --> 00:53:25,339
back to Winnipeg where he's from and

1170
00:53:33,230 --> 00:53:29,630
he's taken to a hospital and where they

1171
00:53:35,509 --> 00:53:33,240
kind of like they don't really do a lot

1172
00:53:38,240 --> 00:53:35,519
for him they give him medications for

1173
00:53:40,700 --> 00:53:38,250
like his nausea and for some other

1174
00:53:43,400 --> 00:53:40,710
symptoms but they don't really know

1175
00:53:45,829 --> 00:53:43,410
what's causing it and they ruled out

1176
00:53:47,329 --> 00:53:45,839
radiation poisoning which is weird

1177
00:53:49,670 --> 00:53:47,339
because the guy has kind of like

1178
00:53:53,920 --> 00:53:49,680
symptoms of radiation by and large but

1179
00:53:56,809 --> 00:53:53,930
yeah we should stress like he had these

1180
00:53:59,900 --> 00:53:56,819
circular burn marks on like his lower

1181
00:54:01,940 --> 00:53:59,910
abdomen that matched what he says was

1182
00:54:04,370 --> 00:54:01,950
the same like grid on the portholes of

1183
00:54:07,220 --> 00:54:04,380
the craft so if you're right if if if

1184
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:07,230
that exhaust came out and burned him

1185
00:54:12,789 --> 00:54:09,210
like it matched perfectly to the sketch

1186
00:54:17,029 --> 00:54:12,799
he made of the craft that he saw so yeah

1187
00:54:19,579 --> 00:54:17,039
absolutely and eventually he actually

1188
00:54:24,980 --> 00:54:19,589
ended up going to the Mayo Clinic in

1189
00:54:28,970 --> 00:54:24,990
Minnesota and they studied him for about

1190
00:54:30,829 --> 00:54:28,980
a week he goes back and like for a while

1191
00:54:33,950 --> 00:54:30,839
he actually had to fight to get his

1192
00:54:37,099 --> 00:54:33,960
medical records because they never sent

1193
00:54:40,460 --> 00:54:37,109
them to him he actually I believe it was

1194
00:54:42,559 --> 00:54:40,470
John keel and another researcher named

1195
00:54:45,289 --> 00:54:42,569
Bertold Schwartz who actually helped him

1196
00:54:47,450 --> 00:54:45,299
fill out like medical release forms in

1197
00:54:49,579 --> 00:54:47,460
order to get his stuff but they never

1198
00:54:52,009 --> 00:54:49,589
found anything you know out of the

1199
00:54:54,740 --> 00:54:52,019
ordinary but what he noted was like

1200
00:54:58,160 --> 00:54:54,750
every I think it was like every three

1201
00:55:01,819 --> 00:54:58,170
weeks the like grid pattern burn that

1202
00:55:03,890 --> 00:55:01,829
was on his abdomen would this would come

1203
00:55:06,079 --> 00:55:03,900
back it would disappear and then come

1204
00:55:08,539 --> 00:55:06,089
back and the symptoms would come back

1205
00:55:12,019 --> 00:55:08,549
from it too which is wild yeah that's

1206
00:55:15,589 --> 00:55:12,029
pretty weird but the investigators did

1207
00:55:16,370 --> 00:55:15,599
end up going back to the site where it

1208
00:55:19,130 --> 00:55:16,380
had

1209
00:55:21,519 --> 00:55:19,140
and they found like that there was like

1210
00:55:23,690 --> 00:55:21,529
radioactive ore running underneath it

1211
00:55:27,710 --> 00:55:23,700
but they found that there was like a

1212
00:55:30,890 --> 00:55:27,720
large burnt area on this rock where it

1213
00:55:33,319 --> 00:55:30,900
was black so you know some physical

1214
00:55:34,999 --> 00:55:33,329
evidence there they found I think there

1215
00:55:38,390 --> 00:55:35,009
were like some trees nearby that had

1216
00:55:41,329 --> 00:55:38,400
branches that were taken off too but

1217
00:55:44,359 --> 00:55:41,339
there was also a year after the incident

1218
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:44,369
happened michalak returned to the

1219
00:55:49,519 --> 00:55:47,249
landing site again with a friend and

1220
00:55:52,479 --> 00:55:49,529
they found this like very strange kind

1221
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:52,489
of like silver that was coated with

1222
00:55:57,890 --> 00:55:55,410
radioactive ore that a lot of people

1223
00:56:00,739 --> 00:55:57,900
think was like planted for some reason

1224
00:56:03,229 --> 00:56:00,749
yeah yeah they found it like not too far

1225
00:56:04,519 --> 00:56:03,239
below the ground I think but enough

1226
00:56:06,380 --> 00:56:04,529
where people are like oh it looks like

1227
00:56:08,390 --> 00:56:06,390
you always kind of freshly dug in there

1228
00:56:10,460 --> 00:56:08,400
this is one of the biggest mysteries one

1229
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:10,470
of the biggest puzzles and skeptics have

1230
00:56:15,559 --> 00:56:13,410
pointed to this as the reason why the

1231
00:56:17,870 --> 00:56:15,569
case should be discounted why would

1232
00:56:20,359 --> 00:56:17,880
particles and metal fragments of this

1233
00:56:22,849 --> 00:56:20,369
size and radioactivity have been missed

1234
00:56:24,229 --> 00:56:22,859
by all previous investigators and this

1235
00:56:26,509 --> 00:56:24,239
is one mystery that we don't have

1236
00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:26,519
definite answers to this day you have

1237
00:56:31,430 --> 00:56:28,650
that going on but I mean otherwise this

1238
00:56:33,799 --> 00:56:31,440
is a like a pretty solid case it is it's

1239
00:56:36,079 --> 00:56:33,809
solid and I think you know the Canadian

1240
00:56:38,059 --> 00:56:36,089
Air Force got involved with some people

1241
00:56:40,430 --> 00:56:38,069
from the US they came down to

1242
00:56:44,329 --> 00:56:40,440
investigate and you know like you

1243
00:56:46,759 --> 00:56:44,339
mentioned Chris Rakowski was a big part

1244
00:56:48,799 --> 00:56:46,769
of this entire thing and you know to

1245
00:56:51,559 --> 00:56:48,809
this day says it's one of the best cases

1246
00:56:53,870 --> 00:56:51,569
Canada ever had and I'd have to agree I

1247
00:56:57,469 --> 00:56:53,880
mean you know there's some bumps along

1248
00:57:00,440 --> 00:56:57,479
the way with some dubious researchers

1249
00:57:03,319 --> 00:57:00,450
that mikkeluc got involved with but that

1250
00:57:05,089 --> 00:57:03,329
happens to any UFO witness you know you

1251
00:57:07,519 --> 00:57:05,099
got to be careful who you end up working

1252
00:57:09,950 --> 00:57:07,529
with because their intentions might not

1253
00:57:12,349 --> 00:57:09,960
be is how would you say altruistic is

1254
00:57:14,809 --> 00:57:12,359
you hope they'd be but one of the other

1255
00:57:18,109 --> 00:57:14,819
things Rob I thought was interesting in

1256
00:57:20,539 --> 00:57:18,119
the book written by by his son he

1257
00:57:23,900 --> 00:57:20,549
remembers when unsolved mysteries came

1258
00:57:26,299 --> 00:57:23,910
to film his father for this and during

1259
00:57:28,339 --> 00:57:26,309
breaks one of the guys one of the like

1260
00:57:30,050 --> 00:57:28,349
crew members kind of passively said to

1261
00:57:31,670 --> 00:57:30,060
to the father

1262
00:57:33,980 --> 00:57:31,680
man this must have been the most

1263
00:57:36,170 --> 00:57:33,990
difficult and like most remarkable

1264
00:57:38,570 --> 00:57:36,180
experience of your life and his father

1265
00:57:41,540 --> 00:57:38,580
shook his head and said no being in a

1266
00:57:43,610 --> 00:57:41,550
concentration camp escaping to America

1267
00:57:45,830 --> 00:57:43,620
joining the army and going to Germany to

1268
00:57:47,780 --> 00:57:45,840
translate in dismantle concentration

1269
00:57:50,270 --> 00:57:47,790
camps was the most difficult part of my

1270
00:57:52,670 --> 00:57:50,280
life yeah holy [\h__\h] dude so at this

1271
00:57:54,380 --> 00:57:52,680
point like all the unsolved mysteries

1272
00:57:57,230 --> 00:57:54,390
crew are gathered around and he's like

1273
00:57:59,150 --> 00:57:57,240
regaling them with these other stories

1274
00:58:02,090 --> 00:57:59,160
so I mean even this dude might have

1275
00:58:05,930 --> 00:58:02,100
witnessed beings from another world land

1276
00:58:08,060 --> 00:58:05,940
but he can even say to himself like I've

1277
00:58:11,180 --> 00:58:08,070
experienced much more difficult things

1278
00:58:14,900 --> 00:58:11,190
in my life yeah absolutely he's uh I

1279
00:58:16,880 --> 00:58:14,910
love that man so much thank you yeah you

1280
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:16,890
spent how many languages could dude

1281
00:58:21,260 --> 00:58:20,010
speak it's just crazy like I wish I

1282
00:58:24,290 --> 00:58:21,270
could have met this guy you know

1283
00:58:28,100 --> 00:58:24,300
unfortunately he did pass away yeah he

1284
00:58:30,530 --> 00:58:28,110
passed away I think in the 90s yeah

1285
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:30,540
that's the point yeah yeah yeah so I

1286
00:58:35,330 --> 00:58:33,570
mean we kind of only have this story to

1287
00:58:37,790 --> 00:58:35,340
rely on at this point but like I said

1288
00:58:40,340 --> 00:58:37,800
his son has been very vocal he co-wrote

1289
00:58:42,770 --> 00:58:40,350
a book with Chris Markowski and and his

1290
00:58:44,120 --> 00:58:42,780
father about all of this so definitely I

1291
00:58:46,760 --> 00:58:44,130
think people should check this one out

1292
00:58:49,700 --> 00:58:46,770
is it is definitely one of the most

1293
00:58:51,110 --> 00:58:49,710
underrated cases I think out there but

1294
00:58:55,210 --> 00:58:51,120
here's one here's our next one

1295
00:58:59,240 --> 00:58:55,220
Rob August 20th 1976 the allagash

1296
00:59:01,610 --> 00:58:59,250
abduction I hate this one so much hate

1297
00:59:04,820 --> 00:59:01,620
it you hate it well too bad brother

1298
00:59:08,870 --> 00:59:04,830
we're going we're going full full-on

1299
00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:08,880
dude nude with this one who are they and

1300
00:59:14,510 --> 00:59:11,610
where do they come from are they real or

1301
00:59:16,220 --> 00:59:14,520
imagined in recent years hundreds of

1302
00:59:18,590 --> 00:59:16,230
people have come forward with startling

1303
00:59:21,350 --> 00:59:18,600
accounts of abduction by alien beings

1304
00:59:22,130 --> 00:59:21,360
and the fantastic saga of the allagash

1305
00:59:24,229 --> 00:59:22,140
war

1306
00:59:26,749 --> 00:59:24,239
four young men who claim that they were

1307
00:59:29,569 --> 00:59:26,759
abducted by aliens during a camping trip

1308
00:59:32,150 --> 00:59:29,579
in the Maine wilderness they're chilling

1309
00:59:33,890 --> 00:59:32,160
story may seem unbelievable but more and

1310
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:33,900
more people have become convinced that

1311
00:59:39,620 --> 00:59:36,210
such accounts are based in fact not

1312
00:59:41,569 --> 00:59:39,630
fiction allagash abduction this episode

1313
00:59:44,930 --> 00:59:41,579
covers a bunch of different UFO related

1314
00:59:46,729 --> 00:59:44,940
stories but um this one actually focuses

1315
00:59:49,609 --> 00:59:46,739
this segment we're talking about on the

1316
00:59:53,329 --> 00:59:49,619
allagash for case out of Maine and it

1317
00:59:56,299 --> 00:59:53,339
opens immediately with we get one of the

1318
00:59:58,849 --> 00:59:56,309
men Jack recalling that he wakes up in

1319
01:00:02,089 --> 00:59:58,859
this unfamiliar room and he's completely

1320
01:00:05,150 --> 01:00:02,099
naked and to his left he sees a in a

1321
01:00:09,079 --> 01:00:05,160
trance almost his brother Jim and their

1322
01:00:12,019 --> 01:00:09,089
two friends Chuck and Charlie and then

1323
01:00:14,539 --> 01:00:12,029
it just goes full-on alien abduction

1324
01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:14,549
from here man um do you wanna you want

1325
01:00:19,999 --> 01:00:15,690
to run through this one or you want me

1326
01:00:24,319 --> 01:00:20,009
to do this I've covered it so I'll run

1327
01:00:29,089 --> 01:00:24,329
through it a little bit essentially what

1328
01:00:34,069 --> 01:00:29,099
happened is that Ray Fowler was doing

1329
01:00:35,989 --> 01:00:34,079
this UFO like talk it was like a it was

1330
01:00:39,950 --> 01:00:35,999
like a conference somewhere in

1331
01:00:41,390 --> 01:00:39,960
Massachusetts where it was in this small

1332
01:00:43,519 --> 01:00:41,400
like Church or something like that and

1333
01:00:45,920 --> 01:00:43,529
it was kind of like a cult stuff and he

1334
01:00:47,420 --> 01:00:45,930
was there selling books and giving

1335
01:00:52,430 --> 01:00:47,430
presentations and while he was selling

1336
01:00:54,079 --> 01:00:52,440
books it's Jim Weiner one of the

1337
01:00:55,729 --> 01:00:54,089
witnesses in this case comes up to him

1338
01:00:58,130 --> 01:00:55,739
and says I've been having these dreams

1339
01:00:59,979 --> 01:00:58,140
I think they you know correspond to this

1340
01:01:04,390 --> 01:00:59,989
time I was camping with my buddies in

1341
01:01:07,999 --> 01:01:04,400
1976 and we had this UFO encounter so

1342
01:01:11,739 --> 01:01:08,009
essentially Fowler does the the heavy

1343
01:01:14,539 --> 01:01:11,749
lifting on this one and he finds that

1344
01:01:17,089 --> 01:01:14,549
through hypnosis with all these guys and

1345
01:01:19,970 --> 01:01:17,099
hearing their story they went out into

1346
01:01:22,370 --> 01:01:19,980
the allagash wilderness of Maine which

1347
01:01:24,950 --> 01:01:22,380
is very remote and in the places where

1348
01:01:26,650 --> 01:01:24,960
they ended up and camping and stuff the

1349
01:01:29,450 --> 01:01:26,660
only way to get in there is through

1350
01:01:33,229 --> 01:01:29,460
airplane they literally had to be flown

1351
01:01:35,569 --> 01:01:33,239
in there and they basically hopped from

1352
01:01:37,969 --> 01:01:35,579
site to site to site they were

1353
01:01:41,299 --> 01:01:37,979
basically you know canoeing by day and

1354
01:01:45,559 --> 01:01:41,309
then camping at night so they end up

1355
01:01:49,089 --> 01:01:45,569
having the this UFO experience not long

1356
01:01:52,130 --> 01:01:49,099
it was like two days into their trip and

1357
01:01:53,930 --> 01:01:52,140
McKidd seemed in the episode like all of

1358
01:01:55,969 --> 01:01:53,940
them have see all of them saw it but I

1359
01:01:57,920 --> 01:01:55,979
think it was only Jack Weiner that had

1360
01:02:00,049 --> 01:01:57,930
seen it that night but he sees this you

1361
01:02:02,329 --> 01:02:00,059
know light just above the trees and it

1362
01:02:05,890 --> 01:02:02,339
just kind of like implodes and

1363
01:02:08,809 --> 01:02:05,900
disappears but a couple of nights later

1364
01:02:11,870 --> 01:02:08,819
they're on I believe Eagle Lake and

1365
01:02:15,079 --> 01:02:11,880
they're on this camping site it's just

1366
01:02:17,120 --> 01:02:15,089
the four of them and they don't have

1367
01:02:19,339 --> 01:02:17,130
enough food with them at the time they

1368
01:02:20,630 --> 01:02:19,349
went fishing during the day but they

1369
01:02:22,699 --> 01:02:20,640
didn't catch anything that was really

1370
01:02:25,069 --> 01:02:22,709
all that edible so they were gonna do

1371
01:02:28,789 --> 01:02:25,079
some night fishing so they go out on the

1372
01:02:30,650 --> 01:02:28,799
lake it's probably like 8:30 at night or

1373
01:02:35,870 --> 01:02:30,660
something like that and they build this

1374
01:02:38,509 --> 01:02:35,880
huge like massive like bonfire to mark

1375
01:02:42,650 --> 01:02:38,519
their camping site so they're out there

1376
01:02:44,779 --> 01:02:42,660
for maybe 15 minutes and the guy of the

1377
01:02:46,130 --> 01:02:44,789
rear of the boat Chuck Rach he turns

1378
01:02:48,170 --> 01:02:46,140
around because he feels like he's being

1379
01:02:50,390 --> 01:02:48,180
watched and he sees this light above the

1380
01:02:53,029 --> 01:02:50,400
trees I had a feeling that there was

1381
01:02:55,670 --> 01:02:53,039
someone staring at me from behind me I

1382
01:02:59,569 --> 01:02:55,680
turned over my right shoulder like that

1383
01:03:01,759 --> 01:02:59,579
and I saw this large round globe of

1384
01:03:04,729 --> 01:03:01,769
light that looked exactly like what we

1385
01:03:07,759 --> 01:03:04,739
had seen two nights previously so he

1386
01:03:09,799 --> 01:03:07,769
calls out to the rest of the guys he's

1387
01:03:12,049 --> 01:03:09,809
like hey over there and automatically

1388
01:03:13,579 --> 01:03:12,059
they just know where he's pointing to

1389
01:03:15,109 --> 01:03:13,589
where he's looking at this thing they

1390
01:03:17,449 --> 01:03:15,119
all turn and they look in the area and

1391
01:03:19,910 --> 01:03:17,459
they see this light above the trees so

1392
01:03:21,799 --> 01:03:19,920
it's Charlie Fults at the front of the

1393
01:03:23,599 --> 01:03:21,809
boat who has this brilliant idea that

1394
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:23,609
he's going to take the flashlight that

1395
01:03:31,249 --> 01:03:26,130
they have with them and signal this

1396
01:03:34,339 --> 01:03:31,259
thing okay PSA time here again if you're

1397
01:03:36,049 --> 01:03:34,349
going to signal a UFO with a flashlight

1398
01:03:38,449 --> 01:03:36,059
there are great ways to do it and there

1399
01:03:42,259 --> 01:03:38,459
are wrong ways to do it now in two cases

1400
01:03:45,859 --> 01:03:42,269
there are two individuals that used the

1401
01:03:47,959 --> 01:03:45,869
SOS to signal UFO and in both cases they

1402
01:03:49,339 --> 01:03:47,969
were abducted in this case it's the

1403
01:03:51,259 --> 01:03:49,349
allagash guys in the

1404
01:03:53,210 --> 01:03:51,269
cases Terry Lovelace and the guy that he

1405
01:03:55,190 --> 01:03:53,220
was with they signaled SOS and you know

1406
01:03:55,729 --> 01:03:55,200
what they those UFOs they came and they

1407
01:03:59,839 --> 01:03:55,739
took them

1408
01:04:02,029 --> 01:03:59,849
don't signal SOS well when when the

1409
01:04:06,289 --> 01:04:02,039
light started coming toward us my

1410
01:04:08,809 --> 01:04:06,299
curiosity was satisfied and I I just

1411
01:04:11,210 --> 01:04:08,819
dropped the flash like the only fight in

1412
01:04:11,839 --> 01:04:11,220
my mind was to get to shore I never

1413
01:04:17,839 --> 01:04:11,849
looked back

1414
01:04:20,150 --> 01:04:17,849
I remember looking over my shoulder

1415
01:04:22,370 --> 01:04:20,160
trying to keep an eye on this object as

1416
01:04:24,319 --> 01:04:22,380
it was coming up behind us and and it

1417
01:04:26,870 --> 01:04:24,329
was getting very close I mean it was

1418
01:04:28,880 --> 01:04:26,880
almost on top of us at this point and I

1419
01:04:31,099 --> 01:04:28,890
remember thinking that we're not gonna

1420
01:04:36,140 --> 01:04:31,109
outrun this thing there's just no way it

1421
01:04:39,440 --> 01:04:36,150
was coming too quickly so if you are

1422
01:04:41,059 --> 01:04:39,450
signaling SOS that UFO is gonna come and

1423
01:04:43,279 --> 01:04:41,069
pick you up and you know what it's gonna

1424
01:04:46,719 --> 01:04:43,289
cost you trauma it's gonna cause trouble

1425
01:04:50,539 --> 01:04:46,729
just they're very they're very literal

1426
01:04:52,279 --> 01:04:50,549
aliens yeah you know very literal aliens

1427
01:04:54,349 --> 01:04:52,289
they thought they were in trouble so

1428
01:04:57,529 --> 01:04:54,359
they abducted these four guys and the

1429
01:04:59,839 --> 01:04:57,539
thing is is like at the time they're in

1430
01:05:02,239 --> 01:04:59,849
their canoe and they're paddling as

1431
01:05:04,279 --> 01:05:02,249
quick as they can to shore and it's

1432
01:05:06,680 --> 01:05:04,289
almost like a cutscene in a movie where

1433
01:05:08,089 --> 01:05:06,690
they're all they're in the boat and then

1434
01:05:10,910 --> 01:05:08,099
all of a sudden they're on shore and

1435
01:05:12,950 --> 01:05:10,920
they're looking up at this UFO and they

1436
01:05:15,829 --> 01:05:12,960
assume that they'd just like outrun this

1437
01:05:17,479 --> 01:05:15,839
thing but like you're thinking deep down

1438
01:05:19,459 --> 01:05:17,489
in your mind there's no way that four

1439
01:05:21,410 --> 01:05:19,469
guys in a canoe could outrun a UFO

1440
01:05:22,940 --> 01:05:21,420
that's just like flying it can go as

1441
01:05:27,200 --> 01:05:22,950
fast as it really wants to

1442
01:05:30,469 --> 01:05:27,210
so this Epis this incident gets

1443
01:05:35,359 --> 01:05:30,479
forgotten for years it's like over a

1444
01:05:37,640 --> 01:05:35,369
decade before it's Jim leaner he has

1445
01:05:38,930 --> 01:05:37,650
this hiked house household in the

1446
01:05:42,950 --> 01:05:38,940
accident

1447
01:05:47,690 --> 01:05:42,960
he falls off a ladder and through it he

1448
01:05:51,529 --> 01:05:47,700
ends up can he comes down with I think

1449
01:05:55,219 --> 01:05:51,539
it's like temporal lobe epilepsy mm-hmm

1450
01:05:58,309 --> 01:05:55,229
it develops and he starts having these

1451
01:05:59,779 --> 01:05:58,319
weird dreams and then he starts talking

1452
01:06:01,370 --> 01:05:59,789
to his brother and he realizes that his

1453
01:06:03,260 --> 01:06:01,380
brother is having these dreams so they

1454
01:06:07,430 --> 01:06:03,270
come forward to Ray Fowler

1455
01:06:11,930 --> 01:06:07,440
they go through hypnosis and they find

1456
01:06:13,820 --> 01:06:11,940
that these four guys were abducted and a

1457
01:06:15,920 --> 01:06:13,830
lot of them described coming up like

1458
01:06:19,790 --> 01:06:15,930
this tube which is interesting because

1459
01:06:22,580 --> 01:06:19,800
in many cases when abductees talk about

1460
01:06:25,070 --> 01:06:22,590
they're being taken they're never

1461
01:06:26,690 --> 01:06:25,080
usually describing the process they're

1462
01:06:28,760 --> 01:06:26,700
usually it's just like hey there's some

1463
01:06:30,530 --> 01:06:28,770
aliens they're taking me somewhere and

1464
01:06:32,720 --> 01:06:30,540
then boom you're in the ship but these

1465
01:06:35,570 --> 01:06:32,730
guys describe being taken up into a room

1466
01:06:37,840 --> 01:06:35,580
they were led to another room in which

1467
01:06:40,580 --> 01:06:37,850
you know they were stripped naked and

1468
01:06:42,950 --> 01:06:40,590
they were subjected to medical tests now

1469
01:06:46,310 --> 01:06:42,960
three out of four of these guys are

1470
01:06:47,810 --> 01:06:46,320
lifelong experiencers so Jim and Jack

1471
01:06:52,220 --> 01:06:47,820
Weiner they're interesting cuz they're

1472
01:06:54,590 --> 01:06:52,230
twins so they were experiencers and if

1473
01:06:57,200 --> 01:06:54,600
you read Ray Fowler's book the allagash

1474
01:06:59,359 --> 01:06:57,210
abductions which is [\h__\h] terrifying

1475
01:07:01,220 --> 01:06:59,369
you know especially for the pictures

1476
01:07:04,120 --> 01:07:01,230
that are in it that make a [\h__\h]

1477
01:07:08,260 --> 01:07:04,130
appearance in this [\h__\h] show right

1478
01:07:11,420 --> 01:07:08,270
what what you find is like they're all

1479
01:07:13,790 --> 01:07:11,430
subjected to medical tests by and large

1480
01:07:16,130 --> 01:07:13,800
but like the they kind of vary a little

1481
01:07:18,500 --> 01:07:16,140
bit they do some interesting stuff with

1482
01:07:21,370 --> 01:07:18,510
Charlie Falls who is the only non

1483
01:07:24,320 --> 01:07:21,380
lifelong experiencer among them he

1484
01:07:28,099 --> 01:07:24,330
there's like this like chest plate that

1485
01:07:32,060 --> 01:07:28,109
has put over him and it almost scans his

1486
01:07:34,280 --> 01:07:32,070
body and when Chuck Rack describes it he

1487
01:07:37,670 --> 01:07:34,290
describes it as being like embedded into

1488
01:07:39,650 --> 01:07:37,680
his chest and he claims that it looks

1489
01:07:43,609 --> 01:07:39,660
like it's first sucking something out of

1490
01:07:45,890 --> 01:07:43,619
the body and [\h__\h] no thank you all

1491
01:07:48,230 --> 01:07:45,900
for so they were taken aboard the craft

1492
01:07:50,540 --> 01:07:48,240
the aliens forced them to strip naked

1493
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:50,550
and seemed to be conducting medical

1494
01:07:54,730 --> 01:07:52,490
examinations

1495
01:07:56,770 --> 01:07:54,740
the aliens apparently took samples of

1496
01:07:59,920 --> 01:07:56,780
the men's skin and body fluids their

1497
01:08:03,970 --> 01:07:59,930
blood urine and semen man just in this

1498
01:08:06,339 --> 01:08:03,980
episode they play some of the audio from

1499
01:08:09,010 --> 01:08:06,349
the hypnosis sessions which I don't

1500
01:08:12,490 --> 01:08:09,020
recommend don't do hypnosis knows this

1501
01:08:15,940 --> 01:08:12,500
is terrible in these situations just

1502
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:15,950
just don't do it no I will have to

1503
01:08:22,180 --> 01:08:17,810
second that and you know I have written

1504
01:08:24,760 --> 01:08:22,190
in the past about regression in my book

1505
01:08:27,329 --> 01:08:24,770
specifically and those who underwent it

1506
01:08:29,680 --> 01:08:27,339
and I even featured some of the

1507
01:08:32,079 --> 01:08:29,690
therapists who have done it and while I

1508
01:08:35,650 --> 01:08:32,089
respect them as individuals I don't

1509
01:08:37,660 --> 01:08:35,660
personally condone this this way of

1510
01:08:39,940 --> 01:08:37,670
dealing with these things I think Chris

1511
01:08:41,950 --> 01:08:39,950
Cogswell says it best go to an actual

1512
01:08:43,870 --> 01:08:41,960
therapist if you mean this has happened

1513
01:08:47,620 --> 01:08:43,880
to you not someone who claims to be an

1514
01:08:50,410 --> 01:08:47,630
alien abduction therapist so yeah let's

1515
01:08:52,630 --> 01:08:50,420
get that out there before anything but

1516
01:08:54,729 --> 01:08:52,640
you did mention yeah they play some of

1517
01:08:56,950 --> 01:08:54,739
the audio from the regression which was

1518
01:08:59,749 --> 01:08:56,960
terrifying their face is right in my

1519
01:09:12,930 --> 01:09:04,240
I don't know why I don't want to know I

1520
01:09:16,550 --> 01:09:14,719
saying things

1521
01:09:20,160 --> 01:09:16,560
[Music]

1522
01:09:20,170 --> 01:09:28,260
explaining things with their eyes

1523
01:09:28,270 --> 01:09:32,309
in my head

1524
01:09:40,829 --> 01:09:35,039
they're saying

1525
01:09:44,470 --> 01:09:40,839
don't be afraid we won't harm you do

1526
01:09:50,740 --> 01:09:48,820
just do what we say um they show the

1527
01:09:52,990 --> 01:09:50,750
sketches that a lot of the dudes made of

1528
01:09:54,610 --> 01:09:53,000
the aliens and what they experienced so

1529
01:09:58,030 --> 01:09:54,620
I mean we're getting hit from every

1530
01:10:02,380 --> 01:09:58,040
angle with with what these men endured

1531
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:02,390
if any of this is true you know yeah and

1532
01:10:06,430 --> 01:10:04,489
I mean these guys all met through art

1533
01:10:10,330 --> 01:10:06,440
school so every single one of them are

1534
01:10:12,580 --> 01:10:10,340
artists so which always always made me a

1535
01:10:15,580 --> 01:10:12,590
little hesitant with this pace to be

1536
01:10:18,190 --> 01:10:15,590
honest because if you know anyone in art

1537
01:10:21,250 --> 01:10:18,200
school like this is what you do you try

1538
01:10:24,520 --> 01:10:21,260
to create your grand open maybe this was

1539
01:10:27,190 --> 01:10:24,530
like a big performance piece but I you

1540
01:10:28,810 --> 01:10:27,200
know I have no basis for that whatsoever

1541
01:10:31,060 --> 01:10:28,820
but when I did hear that they were all

1542
01:10:32,920 --> 01:10:31,070
involved in the arts somehow that did

1543
01:10:34,780 --> 01:10:32,930
rub me the wrong way I don't blame

1544
01:10:37,270 --> 01:10:34,790
people when they are hesitant when they

1545
01:10:41,290 --> 01:10:37,280
hear something like that yeah and if you

1546
01:10:43,990 --> 01:10:41,300
look at some of the earlier editions of

1547
01:10:47,170 --> 01:10:44,000
Ray Fowler's book you can actually order

1548
01:10:50,320 --> 01:10:47,180
some of the artwork to have in your home

1549
01:10:52,030 --> 01:10:50,330
in the back portions of the book it was

1550
01:10:57,310 --> 01:10:52,040
like yeah just what I want hey you know

1551
01:11:00,340 --> 01:10:57,320
yeah yeah exactly and like I when you

1552
01:11:02,560 --> 01:11:00,350
look at them the most terrifying images

1553
01:11:05,350 --> 01:11:02,570
that are drawn are drawn by Jack Weiner

1554
01:11:08,770 --> 01:11:05,360
and in fact if you look at the book a

1555
01:11:10,870 --> 01:11:08,780
lot of his art dominates it and a lot of

1556
01:11:13,120 --> 01:11:10,880
stuff happens to Jack lean or including

1557
01:11:15,460 --> 01:11:13,130
you know additional experiences after

1558
01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:15,470
this incident in his Vermont home and

1559
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:18,650
they are there's like incidents in their

1560
01:11:24,700 --> 01:11:22,010
childhood that they experienced together

1561
01:11:26,890 --> 01:11:24,710
and separately but the the most

1562
01:11:28,240 --> 01:11:26,900
terrifying parts are the stuff that you

1563
01:11:30,910 --> 01:11:28,250
don't even realize because it's not

1564
01:11:33,250 --> 01:11:30,920
included in this episode because you

1565
01:11:35,530 --> 01:11:33,260
only have so much time so when they were

1566
01:11:38,350 --> 01:11:35,540
in the middle of doing all of this

1567
01:11:40,420 --> 01:11:38,360
regressive hypnosis Jack Weiner would

1568
01:11:43,750 --> 01:11:40,430
have dreams that these beings would

1569
01:11:46,720 --> 01:11:43,760
appear to him as while he was doing you

1570
01:11:48,430 --> 01:11:46,730
know mundane things with like Jim and

1571
01:11:50,830 --> 01:11:48,440
Jack like there's one dream in

1572
01:11:54,700 --> 01:11:50,840
particular that [\h__\h] freaks me out

1573
01:11:58,000 --> 01:11:54,710
but he talked about how they were like

1574
01:11:59,859 --> 01:11:58,010
at a play taking in a performance and

1575
01:12:02,200 --> 01:11:59,869
sitting next to this curtain and this

1576
01:12:04,990 --> 01:12:02,210
alien head materializes into the curtain

1577
01:12:06,910 --> 01:12:05,000
and basically says stop the hypnosis

1578
01:12:12,220 --> 01:12:06,920
wheel we don't want them knowing

1579
01:12:15,339 --> 01:12:12,230
anything so like it continues like after

1580
01:12:17,379 --> 01:12:15,349
this like this being materializes two or

1581
01:12:21,580 --> 01:12:17,389
three times tell them to stop doing this

1582
01:12:25,450 --> 01:12:21,590
but like interesting yeah no no no thank

1583
01:12:28,180 --> 01:12:25,460
you but there's um with these segments

1584
01:12:33,040 --> 01:12:28,190
on solve mysteries usually has a skeptic

1585
01:12:34,930 --> 01:12:33,050
come in and say you know how they don't

1586
01:12:36,910 --> 01:12:34,940
they don't trust it the guy's name is

1587
01:12:40,149 --> 01:12:36,920
dr. William cone and he believes that

1588
01:12:44,020 --> 01:12:40,159
abductions experiences or just basically

1589
01:12:47,020 --> 01:12:44,030
people ripping sci-fi movies from

1590
01:12:50,979 --> 01:12:47,030
television and making them a fixture in

1591
01:12:53,350 --> 01:12:50,989
their own minds and john mack comes on

1592
01:12:56,049 --> 01:12:53,360
the screen and says oh we don't work

1593
01:12:58,149 --> 01:12:56,059
like that usually these are people have

1594
01:13:00,339 --> 01:12:58,159
no interest in abductions have not read

1595
01:13:02,609 --> 01:13:00,349
about or even unfamiliar with the nature

1596
01:13:04,540 --> 01:13:02,619
of the beings and are shocked and

1597
01:13:06,399 --> 01:13:04,550
astounded when they hear someone else

1598
01:13:08,500 --> 01:13:06,409
has had these experiences as well or

1599
01:13:10,359 --> 01:13:08,510
that there is material in the media

1600
01:13:12,100 --> 01:13:10,369
about it yeah which is great cuz they

1601
01:13:15,069 --> 01:13:12,110
kind of have this like back and forth

1602
01:13:18,640 --> 01:13:15,079
between you know a psychiatrist Spacek

1603
01:13:21,819 --> 01:13:18,650
yeah yeah which is great so in short

1604
01:13:22,540 --> 01:13:21,829
[\h__\h] this segment I hate it really okay

1605
01:13:26,020 --> 01:13:22,550
that's good to know

1606
01:13:29,229 --> 01:13:26,030
I mean I've met Charlie Foltz and he's a

1607
01:13:33,669 --> 01:13:29,239
really really nice guy yeah if you were

1608
01:13:35,709 --> 01:13:33,679
to tell somebody 40 years ago that they

1609
01:13:37,959 --> 01:13:35,719
would be able to see on an invention

1610
01:13:39,560 --> 01:13:37,969
called a television set which didn't

1611
01:13:42,680 --> 01:13:39,570
exist

1612
01:13:44,990 --> 01:13:42,690
a meteorite crashing into a planet that

1613
01:13:48,950 --> 01:13:45,000
they can now watch at home that's a

1614
01:13:53,240 --> 01:13:48,960
reality check folks and yet 40 years ago

1615
01:13:54,260 --> 01:13:53,250
that science fiction this happened if

1616
01:13:56,480 --> 01:13:54,270
you believe it

1617
01:14:00,560 --> 01:13:56,490
that's alright if you don't believe it I

1618
01:14:03,740 --> 01:14:00,570
don't care I don't care because it did I

1619
01:14:05,600 --> 01:14:03,750
know you know in the past few years

1620
01:14:08,900 --> 01:14:05,610
there's been kind of a falling-out with

1621
01:14:11,450 --> 01:14:08,910
these guys I don't know much about it I

1622
01:14:14,270 --> 01:14:11,460
never really really got involved with

1623
01:14:16,160 --> 01:14:14,280
this case research wise but I guess one

1624
01:14:18,770 --> 01:14:16,170
of them came forward and said it was all

1625
01:14:20,630 --> 01:14:18,780
a hoax or something like that well the

1626
01:14:21,140 --> 01:14:20,640
interesting thing is yeah it was Chuck

1627
01:14:25,040 --> 01:14:21,150
Rach

1628
01:14:28,070 --> 01:14:25,050
okay and he came forward like maybe four

1629
01:14:30,230 --> 01:14:28,080
years ago now and he said that it wasn't

1630
01:14:33,980 --> 01:14:30,240
the UFO sighting the UFO sighting

1631
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:33,990
happened and everything including like

1632
01:14:41,330 --> 01:14:37,290
the UFO like shooting a beam down and

1633
01:14:44,060 --> 01:14:41,340
them like running back to - sure

1634
01:14:46,490 --> 01:14:44,070
happened but he just basically said the

1635
01:14:48,880 --> 01:14:46,500
abduction stuff didn't happen okay and

1636
01:14:53,180 --> 01:14:48,890
what's interesting is is if you read

1637
01:14:55,490 --> 01:14:53,190
Fowler's book whenever they do hypnotic

1638
01:14:58,390 --> 01:14:55,500
regression on Chuck Rach he never gives

1639
01:15:01,730 --> 01:14:58,400
them much of anything he never like

1640
01:15:03,710 --> 01:15:01,740
fouler kind of chalks it up to him being

1641
01:15:07,310 --> 01:15:03,720
just like a very strong personality but

1642
01:15:10,340 --> 01:15:07,320
I guess Chuck RAC is kind of he has kind

1643
01:15:12,050 --> 01:15:10,350
of a very strong personality and some

1644
01:15:14,750 --> 01:15:12,060
are saying it's because he didn't make

1645
01:15:18,260 --> 01:15:14,760
enough money off of this and stuff like

1646
01:15:20,870 --> 01:15:18,270
that which you know could be a it's very

1647
01:15:22,760 --> 01:15:20,880
weird because like his explanation is

1648
01:15:24,140 --> 01:15:22,770
kind of strange I was like oh no all

1649
01:15:28,040 --> 01:15:24,150
that stuff happened we just didn't get

1650
01:15:31,610 --> 01:15:28,050
abducted like notated you mean 95% of

1651
01:15:33,620 --> 01:15:31,620
the story yeah okay yeah yeah that's

1652
01:15:35,300 --> 01:15:33,630
tough man cuz yeah I mean if they did

1653
01:15:37,490 --> 01:15:35,310
make up the whole abduction part of it

1654
01:15:39,650 --> 01:15:37,500
like that just taints the initial

1655
01:15:42,110 --> 01:15:39,660
sighting which is just as exciting you

1656
01:15:45,770 --> 01:15:42,120
know in my opinion like why why make it

1657
01:15:48,860 --> 01:15:45,780
any more I mean I shouldn't say more why

1658
01:15:50,690 --> 01:15:48,870
make it less credible to be honest like

1659
01:15:53,270 --> 01:15:50,700
I'm gonna believe a UFO sighting over an

1660
01:15:57,230 --> 01:15:53,280
abduction any day and I do believe

1661
01:15:58,940 --> 01:15:57,240
some people probably maybe possibly have

1662
01:16:01,520 --> 01:15:58,950
been abducted I can't say that for sure

1663
01:16:04,370 --> 01:16:01,530
obviously but they believe they happen

1664
01:16:06,830 --> 01:16:04,380
you know so if if that whole thing was

1665
01:16:08,870 --> 01:16:06,840
made up that really sucks and at the

1666
01:16:10,940 --> 01:16:08,880
same time if it wasn't made up like

1667
01:16:12,800 --> 01:16:10,950
clearly there's gaps being filled in for

1668
01:16:15,680 --> 01:16:12,810
memories they don't remember

1669
01:16:18,530 --> 01:16:15,690
and we know memories faulty and we know

1670
01:16:20,630 --> 01:16:18,540
hip hypnosis doesn't really help so yeah

1671
01:16:22,700 --> 01:16:20,640
right that was an interesting case all

1672
01:16:25,640 --> 01:16:22,710
right so the last one we're gonna cover

1673
01:16:28,690 --> 01:16:25,650
here Rob is another benchmark case and

1674
01:16:32,720 --> 01:16:28,700
episode I'd say and this is Rendlesham

1675
01:16:35,000 --> 01:16:32,730
December 26 1980 a US Air Force security

1676
01:16:37,130 --> 01:16:35,010
patrol told of seeing a mysterious

1677
01:16:39,590 --> 01:16:37,140
unearthly visitor near their airbase in

1678
01:16:41,480 --> 01:16:39,600
England during the next two nights a

1679
01:16:44,210 --> 01:16:41,490
rash of sightings astounded even the

1680
01:16:45,830 --> 01:16:44,220
most skeptical military man for years

1681
01:16:49,100 --> 01:16:45,840
these sightings were cloaked in secrecy

1682
01:16:52,010 --> 01:16:49,110
until tonight for the first time former

1683
01:16:54,170 --> 01:16:52,020
Air Force personnel go on camera a tell

1684
01:16:57,710 --> 01:16:54,180
of a close encounter what they believed

1685
01:17:00,620 --> 01:16:57,720
were UFOs I had Nick Redfern on the show

1686
01:17:03,140 --> 01:17:00,630
last week talking all about this so why

1687
01:17:05,390 --> 01:17:03,150
not dive back into this goddamn case for

1688
01:17:07,970 --> 01:17:05,400
the millionth time you can't escape this

1689
01:17:10,760 --> 01:17:07,980
I can't I can't man for those who don't

1690
01:17:12,350 --> 01:17:10,770
know my first dive into the Rendlesham

1691
01:17:15,890 --> 01:17:12,360
case was I was trying to write a play

1692
01:17:17,720 --> 01:17:15,900
about it back in early days with our

1693
01:17:20,720 --> 01:17:17,730
mutual colleague and friend Peter

1694
01:17:23,720 --> 01:17:20,730
Robbins and Larry Warren one of the and

1695
01:17:26,690 --> 01:17:23,730
I'm using air quotes witnesses know you

1696
01:17:31,630 --> 01:17:26,700
those are heavy air quotes man yeah I

1697
01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:36,170
being said the play never saw the light

1698
01:17:40,880 --> 01:17:39,570
of day for obvious reasons but rest

1699
01:17:43,070 --> 01:17:40,890
assured I am still working with Peter

1700
01:17:46,280 --> 01:17:43,080
Robbins on something having to do with

1701
01:17:50,150 --> 01:17:46,290
this stay tuned for that as any good

1702
01:17:52,910 --> 01:17:50,160
writer says let's get into this one for

1703
01:17:54,620 --> 01:17:52,920
the very first time some of the military

1704
01:17:56,900 --> 01:17:54,630
people involved with this came forward

1705
01:17:59,180 --> 01:17:56,910
on unsolved mysteries just like with

1706
01:18:01,250 --> 01:17:59,190
Roswell and Socorro and everything else

1707
01:18:03,620 --> 01:18:01,260
so um yeah I don't think we've really

1708
01:18:05,720 --> 01:18:03,630
got to get too much into the events I

1709
01:18:07,040 --> 01:18:05,730
think our listeners know about it three

1710
01:18:09,200 --> 01:18:07,050
consecutive nights of UFO

1711
01:18:11,840 --> 01:18:09,210
activity over to joint military bases in

1712
01:18:14,360 --> 01:18:11,850
England 1980 but yeah this is the first

1713
01:18:16,220 --> 01:18:14,370
time we hear from John Burroughs yeah

1714
01:18:18,650 --> 01:18:16,230
absolutely I love how like one of the

1715
01:18:19,970 --> 01:18:18,660
first things that he says is who would

1716
01:18:21,770 --> 01:18:19,980
come out in the middle of the woods

1717
01:18:27,590 --> 01:18:21,780
outside an Air Force Base and make a

1718
01:18:29,750 --> 01:18:27,600
Christmas display they see the forest

1719
01:18:32,690 --> 01:18:29,760
I'm like that's great you really thought

1720
01:18:35,330 --> 01:18:32,700
it was a Christmas display okay there

1721
01:18:37,520 --> 01:18:35,340
have been so many explanations for what

1722
01:18:39,230 --> 01:18:37,530
it could have been and that is a big

1723
01:18:41,780 --> 01:18:39,240
part of this you know this happened over

1724
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:41,790
the holiday the holidays so at least for

1725
01:18:46,580 --> 01:18:44,010
us Americans even they were over in

1726
01:18:48,140 --> 01:18:46,590
England and a lot of people think yeah

1727
01:18:50,860 --> 01:18:48,150
maybe it was some sort of Christmas

1728
01:18:54,230 --> 01:18:50,870
display which is kind of ridiculous but

1729
01:18:56,450 --> 01:18:54,240
yeah yeah I think they would have noted

1730
01:18:58,850 --> 01:18:56,460
that you know in their logs and [\h__\h]

1731
01:19:00,440 --> 01:18:58,860
like we found a bunch of idiots out

1732
01:19:02,870 --> 01:19:00,450
there you know putting on some [\h__\h]

1733
01:19:05,780 --> 01:19:02,880
Christmas show and we shut that [\h__\h]

1734
01:19:09,530 --> 01:19:05,790
down we should know more Frosty the

1735
01:19:11,390 --> 01:19:09,540
Snowman so okay so yeah we got airman

1736
01:19:13,280 --> 01:19:11,400
1st class John Burroughs and Jim

1737
01:19:15,350 --> 01:19:13,290
Penniston and a few others they go out

1738
01:19:17,630 --> 01:19:15,360
to investigate these strange lights that

1739
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:17,640
had been reported and an interesting

1740
01:19:21,710 --> 01:19:20,010
side note that they add into this rub is

1741
01:19:23,420 --> 01:19:21,720
the men ought to leave their weapons

1742
01:19:26,210 --> 01:19:23,430
behind when they went out to investigate

1743
01:19:28,430 --> 01:19:26,220
because they were out of your US

1744
01:19:31,670 --> 01:19:28,440
jurisdiction in the forest where this

1745
01:19:33,140 --> 01:19:31,680
event initially occurred so that was

1746
01:19:35,000 --> 01:19:33,150
pretty interesting can you imagine going

1747
01:19:37,940 --> 01:19:35,010
out to investigate like a downed

1748
01:19:40,040 --> 01:19:37,950
aircraft or even possibly a UFO and not

1749
01:19:41,990 --> 01:19:40,050
having any sort of protection man you

1750
01:19:44,120 --> 01:19:42,000
better have a strong ass bag light for

1751
01:19:47,990 --> 01:19:44,130
that [\h__\h] yeah exactly

1752
01:19:51,320 --> 01:19:48,000
throw that [\h__\h] at that whatever but

1753
01:19:53,780 --> 01:19:51,330
this was interesting too the object was

1754
01:19:57,080 --> 01:19:53,790
sighted on radar at Heathrow Airport or

1755
01:19:58,670 --> 01:19:57,090
a object and it was tracked over these

1756
01:20:01,220 --> 01:19:58,680
military bases this is what they told

1757
01:20:04,010 --> 01:20:01,230
John Burroughs and then it disappeared

1758
01:20:05,540 --> 01:20:04,020
off radar so these things were tracked

1759
01:20:07,790 --> 01:20:05,550
on radar which a lot of people didn't

1760
01:20:10,220 --> 01:20:07,800
know either yeah absolutely

1761
01:20:12,670 --> 01:20:10,230
for a period of time before they lost

1762
01:20:15,620 --> 01:20:12,680
sight of it most likely because it like

1763
01:20:17,570 --> 01:20:15,630
came down too low to actually be

1764
01:20:20,180 --> 01:20:17,580
detected by radar but yeah they came

1765
01:20:20,629 --> 01:20:20,190
across this object in the middle of the

1766
01:20:22,489 --> 01:20:20,639
woods

1767
01:20:25,699 --> 01:20:22,499
and what's fascinating about this

1768
01:20:28,639 --> 01:20:25,709
experience and like my first real kind

1769
01:20:31,790 --> 01:20:28,649
of familiarity with it was Nick Pope's

1770
01:20:33,399 --> 01:20:31,800
book that came out a few years ago that

1771
01:20:37,549 --> 01:20:33,409
he wrote with Penniston and Burroughs

1772
01:20:39,859 --> 01:20:37,559
but one of the things that Burroughs

1773
01:20:41,689 --> 01:20:39,869
describes is how time seemed like it was

1774
01:20:43,219 --> 01:20:41,699
moving very slowly when they were near

1775
01:20:46,159 --> 01:20:43,229
this thing when it was happening

1776
01:20:49,489 --> 01:20:46,169
everything seemed to go slower we seem

1777
01:20:51,679 --> 01:20:49,499
to be in like I wouldn't say a time warp

1778
01:20:54,319 --> 01:20:51,689
but like everything appeared to be

1779
01:20:56,270 --> 01:20:54,329
happen slower to us and everything felt

1780
01:20:57,529 --> 01:20:56,280
different but when it was all when it

1781
01:20:59,389 --> 01:20:57,539
disappeared it was like everything was

1782
01:21:02,750 --> 01:20:59,399
normal again the perception of the

1783
01:21:05,029 --> 01:21:02,760
ground the on the air the sky the Stars

1784
01:21:08,419 --> 01:21:05,039
the whole nine yards were different so

1785
01:21:11,060 --> 01:21:08,429
like are you in a different reality when

1786
01:21:12,020 --> 01:21:11,070
you're close to this object like what is

1787
01:21:15,709 --> 01:21:12,030
going on here

1788
01:21:18,589 --> 01:21:15,719
experiencing time differently than other

1789
01:21:21,229 --> 01:21:18,599
people and like what they claimed is

1790
01:21:26,209 --> 01:21:21,239
that when they went looking for this

1791
01:21:26,929 --> 01:21:26,219
thing they had been gone for like 45

1792
01:21:29,600 --> 01:21:26,939
minutes

1793
01:21:32,569 --> 01:21:29,610
and searching for it but to them it only

1794
01:21:34,729 --> 01:21:32,579
felt like I think for Burroughs he said

1795
01:21:37,189 --> 01:21:34,739
it felt like it was like maybe 10 15

1796
01:21:39,199 --> 01:21:37,199
minutes but for Penniston because he got

1797
01:21:41,270 --> 01:21:39,209
the closest to this thing and he even

1798
01:21:42,889 --> 01:21:41,280
touched it he claimed that it felt like

1799
01:21:44,449 --> 01:21:42,899
it was only like a few seconds or

1800
01:21:47,270 --> 01:21:44,459
something like that like I'm only a few

1801
01:21:49,750 --> 01:21:47,280
minutes but yeah these guys like

1802
01:21:53,029 --> 01:21:49,760
experienced time very differently in

1803
01:21:56,209 --> 01:21:53,039
close proximity to this object and I

1804
01:21:58,219 --> 01:21:56,219
must say on the show the it did not look

1805
01:22:00,799 --> 01:21:58,229
anything close to what is this you know

1806
01:22:03,229 --> 01:22:00,809
described or what is on your screen at

1807
01:22:05,810 --> 01:22:03,239
the time what what they described seeing

1808
01:22:08,709 --> 01:22:05,820
was like a triangular shaped object with

1809
01:22:11,810 --> 01:22:08,719
a triangle on top of it basically and

1810
01:22:14,870 --> 01:22:11,820
what's interesting is that they would go

1811
01:22:17,120 --> 01:22:14,880
on to find like circular impressions in

1812
01:22:18,859 --> 01:22:17,130
the ground but the way that Burroughs

1813
01:22:21,560 --> 01:22:18,869
talks about it he didn't feel like it

1814
01:22:23,359 --> 01:22:21,570
was like land it wasn't sitting on the

1815
01:22:24,589 --> 01:22:23,369
ground it was kind of just like hovering

1816
01:22:26,270 --> 01:22:24,599
above it a little bit

1817
01:22:27,649 --> 01:22:26,280
I was hoping when I got out there that

1818
01:22:29,209 --> 01:22:27,659
basically I would see nothing there

1819
01:22:30,919 --> 01:22:29,219
would be no telltale evidence that

1820
01:22:32,260 --> 01:22:30,929
possibly something happened that would

1821
01:22:33,910 --> 01:22:32,270
make it easier for me

1822
01:22:35,560 --> 01:22:33,920
because if there's nothing improving

1823
01:22:37,030 --> 01:22:35,570
that something happened to me you can

1824
01:22:39,160 --> 01:22:37,040
just kind of check it off but when you

1825
01:22:41,800 --> 01:22:39,170
get out there and you find damage to the

1826
01:22:44,010 --> 01:22:41,810
trees depressions in the ground and

1827
01:22:46,360 --> 01:22:44,020
stuff that makes it even more

1828
01:22:48,820 --> 01:22:46,370
unexplainable it's an interesting

1829
01:22:52,660 --> 01:22:48,830
feature of it and then yeah like the

1830
01:22:55,420 --> 01:22:52,670
next night hot had heard of this you

1831
01:22:56,710 --> 01:22:55,430
know earlier in the day saying you know

1832
01:23:00,550 --> 01:22:56,720
it was kind of a joke around the base

1833
01:23:02,740 --> 01:23:00,560
like couple guys saw a UFO and I have to

1834
01:23:04,630 --> 01:23:02,750
mention when they did that scene in this

1835
01:23:07,710 --> 01:23:04,640
though they reenacted the scene where

1836
01:23:11,130 --> 01:23:07,720
Charles halt like comes on to base

1837
01:23:16,090 --> 01:23:14,020
what's going on colonel you're not gonna

1838
01:23:17,290 --> 01:23:16,100
believe this but burrows and Penniston

1839
01:23:22,300 --> 01:23:17,300
we're running around the woods last

1840
01:23:25,560 --> 01:23:22,310
night chasing after UFOs oh my god the

1841
01:23:29,530 --> 01:23:25,570
laughs that that guy made was so easily

1842
01:23:31,810 --> 01:23:29,540
he was such a little dick like like that

1843
01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:31,820
kid in school who would like make fun of

1844
01:23:38,380 --> 01:23:34,010
you for wearing you know off-brand

1845
01:23:40,030 --> 01:23:38,390
sneakers or so yeah it was a good

1846
01:23:42,730 --> 01:23:40,040
reenactment like I wanted to punch him

1847
01:23:46,390 --> 01:23:42,740
square in the nose for that but yeah but

1848
01:23:50,440 --> 01:23:46,400
you know they they end up going out the

1849
01:23:53,280 --> 01:23:50,450
next night mhm and you know that there's

1850
01:23:57,520 --> 01:23:53,290
reports of lights in the woods again and

1851
01:23:58,240 --> 01:23:57,530
they end up taking light hauls out into

1852
01:24:00,610 --> 01:23:58,250
the forest

1853
01:24:02,110 --> 01:24:00,620
it was very skeptical I find what it

1854
01:24:04,180 --> 01:24:02,120
allegedly taking place hard to believe

1855
01:24:07,420 --> 01:24:04,190
and I was really gonna do bunk it quite

1856
01:24:08,920 --> 01:24:07,430
frankly and as events unfolded I became

1857
01:24:10,600 --> 01:24:08,930
more and more concerned that there may

1858
01:24:12,130 --> 01:24:10,610
be something to this but I kept telling

1859
01:24:14,350 --> 01:24:12,140
myself that there had to be some type of

1860
01:24:16,210 --> 01:24:14,360
an explanation for but I certainly

1861
01:24:19,270 --> 01:24:16,220
couldn't find one even to this day I I

1862
01:24:21,010 --> 01:24:19,280
can't explain what happened if they just

1863
01:24:22,930 --> 01:24:21,020
go out and they investigate this thing

1864
01:24:25,690 --> 01:24:22,940
they kind of do this like it's like a

1865
01:24:29,320 --> 01:24:25,700
cat-and-mouse game for like a while and

1866
01:24:32,620 --> 01:24:29,330
they follow it through the forest into

1867
01:24:36,460 --> 01:24:32,630
this clearing they see these like it was

1868
01:24:39,310 --> 01:24:36,470
initially just like red object not even

1869
01:24:40,960 --> 01:24:39,320
an object because it looked I think what

1870
01:24:43,150 --> 01:24:40,970
they had on screen at the time was

1871
01:24:46,179 --> 01:24:43,160
pretty accurate to what they ended up

1872
01:24:49,029 --> 01:24:46,189
seeing it's like this like orb of light

1873
01:24:52,509 --> 01:24:49,039
like almost egg-shaped but he described

1874
01:24:54,850 --> 01:24:52,519
up looking like kind of an eye and it

1875
01:24:56,799 --> 01:24:54,860
kind of got close there for a little bit

1876
01:24:58,750 --> 01:24:56,809
and then it took off so they followed

1877
01:25:00,399 --> 01:24:58,760
this thing through the forest into a

1878
01:25:04,209 --> 01:25:00,409
clearing and then dis clearing they see

1879
01:25:07,089 --> 01:25:04,219
like three smaller objects in the sky

1880
01:25:09,669 --> 01:25:07,099
they're kind of doing this these

1881
01:25:11,439 --> 01:25:09,679
maneuvers and some of them I witness his

1882
01:25:13,870 --> 01:25:11,449
claim that they were like doing like

1883
01:25:18,699 --> 01:25:13,880
almost search patterns searching grids

1884
01:25:21,929 --> 01:25:18,709
looking for something and eventually one

1885
01:25:26,259 --> 01:25:21,939
of these objects kind of just breaks off

1886
01:25:28,600 --> 01:25:26,269
comes near near them and drops a beam of

1887
01:25:32,109 --> 01:25:28,610
light down at the ground not far from

1888
01:25:34,449 --> 01:25:32,119
where halt is we could very clearly see

1889
01:25:38,790 --> 01:25:34,459
it sort of dance the bot in the sky and

1890
01:25:43,500 --> 01:25:41,520
I noticed other beams of light coming

1891
01:25:45,410 --> 01:25:43,510
down from the same object following

1892
01:25:47,670 --> 01:25:45,420
different places on the base

1893
01:25:49,890 --> 01:25:47,680
my boss was standing in his front yard

1894
01:25:53,850 --> 01:25:49,900
at Woodbridge and he could see the beams

1895
01:25:55,320 --> 01:25:53,860
of light falling down and the people in

1896
01:25:57,180 --> 01:25:55,330
that weapons storage area and several

1897
01:26:01,110 --> 01:25:57,190
other places on the base also reported

1898
01:26:04,050 --> 01:26:01,120
the lights so he he says that's the

1899
01:26:06,030 --> 01:26:04,060
closest he ever got to it and even

1900
01:26:08,700 --> 01:26:06,040
Burroughs claims that he went out the

1901
01:26:10,500 --> 01:26:08,710
second night to see you know he could

1902
01:26:12,390 --> 01:26:10,510
see anything he wasn't involved and I

1903
01:26:15,710 --> 01:26:12,400
think of the initial investigation but

1904
01:26:19,980 --> 01:26:15,720
he was nearby with some other people and

1905
01:26:22,860 --> 01:26:19,990
apparently this blue light he witnessed

1906
01:26:24,390 --> 01:26:22,870
came down and actually flew like they

1907
01:26:28,440 --> 01:26:24,400
made it seem like a flew right through

1908
01:26:30,360 --> 01:26:28,450
their truck but the light all that they

1909
01:26:31,830 --> 01:26:30,370
had that wasn't working it lit up reef

1910
01:26:35,130 --> 01:26:31,840
Lee for like a second when it came down

1911
01:26:37,560 --> 01:26:35,140
so that was yeah there was just a ton of

1912
01:26:39,780 --> 01:26:37,570
[\h__\h] going on it was like pandemonium in

1913
01:26:41,370 --> 01:26:39,790
that forest for three nights which is

1914
01:26:43,500 --> 01:26:41,380
interesting and you know I talked to

1915
01:26:45,360 --> 01:26:43,510
Nick Redfern a lot last week about just

1916
01:26:46,890 --> 01:26:45,370
all the crazy stuff that was going on

1917
01:26:49,650 --> 01:26:46,900
and like you mentioned earlier the time

1918
01:26:52,140 --> 01:26:49,660
slowing down aspect every witness seen

1919
01:26:54,210 --> 01:26:52,150
something differently like it does lend

1920
01:26:55,770 --> 01:26:54,220
some credence to some of the theories

1921
01:26:59,070 --> 01:26:55,780
Nick's bringing forward on like

1922
01:27:00,900 --> 01:26:59,080
hallucinogens or hologram like if you

1923
01:27:02,970 --> 01:27:00,910
don't buy into any of the stuff then

1924
01:27:05,160 --> 01:27:02,980
Nick Redfern said at least we can all

1925
01:27:06,920 --> 01:27:05,170
admit like there was some crazy stuff

1926
01:27:10,560 --> 01:27:06,930
going on there this was not just one

1927
01:27:13,560 --> 01:27:10,570
object in the sky over these military

1928
01:27:16,770 --> 01:27:13,570
bases you know yeah yeah absolutely it's

1929
01:27:19,200 --> 01:27:16,780
a bunch of different things but I mean

1930
01:27:21,090 --> 01:27:19,210
like Nick always has a different angle

1931
01:27:24,300 --> 01:27:21,100
with which to come at a lot of these

1932
01:27:27,450 --> 01:27:24,310
stories and I mean he's got his angle

1933
01:27:30,330 --> 01:27:27,460
with the Roswell incident and then there

1934
01:27:34,230 --> 01:27:30,340
are these cases that people interject

1935
01:27:36,980 --> 01:27:34,240
they're like weird kind of angles at

1936
01:27:41,250 --> 01:27:36,990
them there's for instance with the

1937
01:27:46,500 --> 01:27:41,260
Antonio Villas Boas abduction from 1957

1938
01:27:49,110 --> 01:27:46,510
there is one eyewitness that came

1939
01:27:52,319 --> 01:27:49,120
forward saying that it was a CI lit CIA

1940
01:27:54,530 --> 01:27:52,329
led operation to like

1941
01:28:00,390 --> 01:27:54,540
kind of like an MKULTRA kind of thing to

1942
01:28:01,950 --> 01:28:00,400
see how they could take LSD and turn it

1943
01:28:04,350 --> 01:28:01,960
into like an alien abduction or

1944
01:28:07,020 --> 01:28:04,360
something like that I don't and and this

1945
01:28:10,370 --> 01:28:07,030
has been paired at around for cases like

1946
01:28:14,669 --> 01:28:10,380
vs Boas Betty and Barney Hill the

1947
01:28:17,729 --> 01:28:14,679
Pascagoula guys it's like yeah I know I

1948
01:28:20,669 --> 01:28:17,739
don't totally buy it but like you know I

1949
01:28:23,399 --> 01:28:20,679
don't totally shoot it down either but I

1950
01:28:24,200 --> 01:28:23,409
plan to you know yeah it out there I'm

1951
01:28:27,479 --> 01:28:24,210
on the fence

1952
01:28:29,189 --> 01:28:27,489
it's interesting you know right saying

1953
01:28:31,290 --> 01:28:29,199
there's an alternate explanation for all

1954
01:28:33,240 --> 01:28:31,300
of these cases of course there is we

1955
01:28:35,700 --> 01:28:33,250
haven't solved them they are unsolved

1956
01:28:39,870 --> 01:28:35,710
mysteries BAM yeah [\h__\h] we're bringing

1957
01:28:43,080 --> 01:28:39,880
it full circle god damnit what else do

1958
01:28:45,299 --> 01:28:43,090
we owe okay so they did their due

1959
01:28:48,839 --> 01:28:45,309
diligence they got a skeptic on this one

1960
01:28:51,030 --> 01:28:48,849
and guess who it is James McGaha is an

1961
01:28:52,620 --> 01:28:51,040
astronomer a noted UFO skeptic

1962
01:28:55,319 --> 01:28:52,630
it was director of to private

1963
01:28:58,649 --> 01:28:55,329
observatories and the burden of proof

1964
01:29:02,430 --> 01:28:58,659
for any event that is extraordinary is

1965
01:29:06,270 --> 01:29:02,440
upon those making the claim not upon

1966
01:29:09,060 --> 01:29:06,280
those who look at it from a skeptical

1967
01:29:10,770 --> 01:29:09,070
perspective where is the evidence show

1968
01:29:16,140 --> 01:29:10,780
me the evidence and that's what science

1969
01:29:19,410 --> 01:29:16,150
is all about Magee haze in the house the

1970
01:29:23,640 --> 01:29:19,420
worst skeptic they could have found to

1971
01:29:25,500 --> 01:29:23,650
be involved with this case [\h__\h] man

1972
01:29:27,959 --> 01:29:25,510
I'm sorry he does I mean he was like

1973
01:29:31,379 --> 01:29:27,969
bringing someone on to like debate this

1974
01:29:32,790 --> 01:29:31,389
case but holy [\h__\h] like he had no he had

1975
01:29:35,549 --> 01:29:32,800
nothing to add to it

1976
01:29:36,959 --> 01:29:35,559
he had okay he had one interesting thing

1977
01:29:39,780 --> 01:29:36,969
that he said and I think you brought

1978
01:29:40,830 --> 01:29:39,790
this up in one of our earlier cases so

1979
01:29:43,020 --> 01:29:40,840
you had the first night

1980
01:29:45,330 --> 01:29:43,030
there's UFOs reported that's fine all

1981
01:29:47,640 --> 01:29:45,340
right he says like the nights after that

1982
01:29:49,770 --> 01:29:47,650
they everyone has it in their minds that

1983
01:29:52,169 --> 01:29:49,780
are gonna see a UFO so that's obviously

1984
01:29:53,580 --> 01:29:52,179
gonna influence their perception of

1985
01:29:54,780 --> 01:29:53,590
what's going on out there

1986
01:29:56,419 --> 01:29:54,790
same with like going into a haunted

1987
01:29:58,770 --> 01:29:56,429
house if you're going in expecting to

1988
01:30:01,410 --> 01:29:58,780
see or hear something you're probably

1989
01:30:05,430 --> 01:30:01,420
gonna see or hear something but yeah he

1990
01:30:05,890 --> 01:30:05,440
he used the whole lighthouse explanation

1991
01:30:07,209 --> 01:30:05,900
for this

1992
01:30:10,810 --> 01:30:07,219
she I think has been pretty much

1993
01:30:13,330 --> 01:30:10,820
debunked at this point I've forget but

1994
01:30:16,300 --> 01:30:13,340
there was like a it was a special on it

1995
01:30:18,700 --> 01:30:16,310
might have been Josh gates is special on

1996
01:30:21,660 --> 01:30:18,710
UFOs that he did a couple years ago he

1997
01:30:25,390 --> 01:30:21,670
went to that site and he found that like

1998
01:30:27,820 --> 01:30:25,400
there was a panel on the back of it that

1999
01:30:29,979 --> 01:30:27,830
wouldn't have even ended up aiming

2000
01:30:34,990 --> 01:30:29,989
toward the forest so it kind of just

2001
01:30:37,630 --> 01:30:35,000
shot it down yeah so the White House has

2002
01:30:40,439 --> 01:30:37,640
been debunked a million times over I

2003
01:30:43,419 --> 01:30:40,449
mean with any of these cases they are

2004
01:30:46,000 --> 01:30:43,429
still unsolved to this day like we said

2005
01:30:48,340 --> 01:30:46,010
but I'm glad they did Rendlesham it was

2006
01:30:49,810 --> 01:30:48,350
it I thought it was good overall it

2007
01:30:52,620 --> 01:30:49,820
brought a lot of people out of the

2008
01:30:56,919 --> 01:30:52,630
woodwork to come forward with their

2009
01:30:59,229 --> 01:30:56,929
experiences and I was interested to ask

2010
01:31:01,450 --> 01:30:59,239
you this do we know the Hulk tape this

2011
01:31:03,700 --> 01:31:01,460
must have come out like after this right

2012
01:31:05,950 --> 01:31:03,710
okay I I feel like they would have

2013
01:31:07,870 --> 01:31:05,960
included that in this episode which they

2014
01:31:09,899 --> 01:31:07,880
did not so that must have come out a lot

2015
01:31:13,600 --> 01:31:09,909
later after this episode had been

2016
01:31:15,790 --> 01:31:13,610
created I assume yeah I think it was

2017
01:31:17,350 --> 01:31:15,800
kind of like a yeah it was kind of like

2018
01:31:20,649 --> 01:31:17,360
an update or something like that but

2019
01:31:23,649 --> 01:31:20,659
yeah yeah another truly creepy thing to

2020
01:31:25,689 --> 01:31:23,659
listen to but um oh yeah yeah something

2021
01:31:28,870 --> 01:31:25,699
that wasn't creepy that wasn't do rob

2022
01:31:31,750 --> 01:31:28,880
was your conversation with John Tenney

2023
01:31:34,030 --> 01:31:31,760
for those who know who John is or don't

2024
01:31:35,649 --> 01:31:34,040
know who he is he's one of the leading

2025
01:31:38,200 --> 01:31:35,659
weirdos out there looking into

2026
01:31:40,540 --> 01:31:38,210
everything paranormal UFOs the occult

2027
01:31:43,000 --> 01:31:40,550
you name it he's done it and you had him

2028
01:31:45,610 --> 01:31:43,010
on the our strange skies podcast to talk

2029
01:31:48,910 --> 01:31:45,620
about his involvement with unsolved

2030
01:31:50,770 --> 01:31:48,920
mysteries and a question a burning

2031
01:31:52,540 --> 01:31:50,780
question he had for Robert Stack the

2032
01:31:54,820 --> 01:31:52,550
host like do you believe any of this

2033
01:31:56,740 --> 01:31:54,830
stuff and if you don't mind I'd love to

2034
01:31:58,240 --> 01:31:56,750
play a little bit of that right now for

2035
01:32:01,689 --> 01:31:58,250
the audience to hear is that cool yeah

2036
01:32:03,130 --> 01:32:01,699
man go for it I was going to Wayne State

2037
01:32:05,530 --> 01:32:03,140
University I thought I would be a

2038
01:32:08,740 --> 01:32:05,540
history teacher specializing in folklore

2039
01:32:11,350 --> 01:32:08,750
and I got a call from a friend of mine

2040
01:32:12,850 --> 01:32:11,360
who was a researcher on unsolved and he

2041
01:32:15,310 --> 01:32:12,860
said you know we need another person to

2042
01:32:16,720 --> 01:32:15,320
pick up some slack we're getting into

2043
01:32:18,200 --> 01:32:16,730
these weirder episodes because

2044
01:32:20,030 --> 01:32:18,210
originally unsolved was mostly

2045
01:32:23,420 --> 01:32:20,040
or mysteries and unsolved kidnapping

2046
01:32:25,370 --> 01:32:23,430
cases and as that show evolved you know

2047
01:32:28,700 --> 01:32:25,380
eventually at that time with no internet

2048
01:32:31,010 --> 01:32:28,710
and you know you you ran you literally

2049
01:32:32,780 --> 01:32:31,020
ran out of cases that of unsolved

2050
01:32:34,880 --> 01:32:32,790
murders and so they started turning to

2051
01:32:37,070 --> 01:32:34,890
the paranormal in the supernatural and

2052
01:32:39,920 --> 01:32:37,080
discussing things like Lizzie Borden or

2053
01:32:42,140 --> 01:32:39,930
the Gulf Breeze UFO sightings things

2054
01:32:43,340 --> 01:32:42,150
like that and so a friend of mine

2055
01:32:44,750 --> 01:32:43,350
contacted me and said do you want to

2056
01:32:46,640 --> 01:32:44,760
pick up some of the slack on some of

2057
01:32:49,220 --> 01:32:46,650
this research that we have that is

2058
01:32:52,400 --> 01:32:49,230
really weird they knew that that's what

2059
01:32:57,170 --> 01:32:52,410
I was into and so I spent probably I

2060
01:33:00,080 --> 01:32:57,180
think two years doing research and kind

2061
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:00,090
of reconnaissance for unsolved that's

2062
01:33:06,530 --> 01:33:02,010
pretty that's that's honestly really

2063
01:33:08,570 --> 01:33:06,540
awesome because a Robert Stack I think

2064
01:33:11,750 --> 01:33:08,580
haunted my dreams for a certain portion

2065
01:33:13,820 --> 01:33:11,760
of my childhood he was just he had an

2066
01:33:17,030 --> 01:33:13,830
air about himself the way he projected

2067
01:33:20,150 --> 01:33:17,040
himself on that show it just scared the

2068
01:33:21,410 --> 01:33:20,160
bejesus out of me um what was he like

2069
01:33:23,900 --> 01:33:21,420
and I mean I've asked you this question

2070
01:33:25,610 --> 01:33:23,910
on Twitter before but like what kind of

2071
01:33:29,420 --> 01:33:25,620
person was Robert Stack like because

2072
01:33:32,180 --> 01:33:29,430
like the guy ethology in my head about

2073
01:33:32,570 --> 01:33:32,190
the man and I'd probably don't go

2074
01:33:34,910 --> 01:33:32,580
anywhere

2075
01:33:38,150 --> 01:33:34,920
know your mythology about him is is

2076
01:33:40,040 --> 01:33:38,160
right but it's your the mythology that

2077
01:33:43,040 --> 01:33:40,050
people have about Robert Stack is like

2078
01:33:45,380 --> 01:33:43,050
at a four and he was always at like a

2079
01:33:47,900 --> 01:33:45,390
ten I mean he was old-school Golden Age

2080
01:33:51,530 --> 01:33:47,910
of Hollywood so when he walked anywhere

2081
01:33:53,930 --> 01:33:51,540
like he commanded this presence but at

2082
01:33:55,970 --> 01:33:53,940
the same time like in old Hollywood you

2083
01:33:58,700 --> 01:33:55,980
everybody was drunk all the time

2084
01:34:00,470 --> 01:33:58,710
mm-hm and so like there's a lot of times

2085
01:34:02,390 --> 01:34:00,480
if you listen to the voiceovers in

2086
01:34:05,180 --> 01:34:02,400
Episode two unsolved mysteries where you

2087
01:34:07,700 --> 01:34:05,190
can hear him kind of struggling to get

2088
01:34:11,420 --> 01:34:07,710
through the voice-over yeah because he's

2089
01:34:14,780 --> 01:34:11,430
been drinking yeah but he was you know

2090
01:34:16,490 --> 01:34:14,790
classic Hollywood I he knew that he had

2091
01:34:19,190 --> 01:34:16,500
been around for a long time he knew that

2092
01:34:22,070 --> 01:34:19,200
people loved him and there was one time

2093
01:34:24,350 --> 01:34:22,080
I had a discussion with him because I

2094
01:34:28,190 --> 01:34:24,360
had been working and researching for

2095
01:34:29,900 --> 01:34:28,200
them and my thing was like does Robert

2096
01:34:31,319 --> 01:34:29,910
Stack believe in anything that he's

2097
01:34:33,929 --> 01:34:31,329
saying

2098
01:34:35,849 --> 01:34:33,939
and so I had a chance one time where I

2099
01:34:38,250 --> 01:34:35,859
asked my I pretty much just put it like

2100
01:34:39,779 --> 01:34:38,260
that I was like you know mr. stack as

2101
01:34:42,419 --> 01:34:39,789
when you're talking about all this stuff

2102
01:34:44,429 --> 01:34:42,429
UFOs and ghosts and psychics and murders

2103
01:34:45,929 --> 01:34:44,439
you know unsolved murders like do you

2104
01:34:49,139 --> 01:34:45,939
believe in any do you have have you ever

2105
01:34:52,859 --> 01:34:49,149
had any supernatural experiences and he

2106
01:34:55,139 --> 01:34:52,869
was kind of coy about it but he kind he

2107
01:34:56,399 --> 01:34:55,149
lapsed into this story about a really

2108
01:34:59,639 --> 01:34:56,409
good friend of his who had worked for

2109
01:35:03,049 --> 01:34:59,649
the Navy and had recounted to Robert

2110
01:35:05,310 --> 01:35:03,059
Stack how he had seen while in the Navy

2111
01:35:07,469 --> 01:35:05,320
UFO is flying around under the water

2112
01:35:09,419 --> 01:35:07,479
well I'm you know under net if I'd

2113
01:35:11,009 --> 01:35:09,429
submerged objects underneath the water

2114
01:35:12,959 --> 01:35:11,019
and they would burst through the water

2115
01:35:14,310 --> 01:35:12,969
and out into the sky and and Robert

2116
01:35:15,540 --> 01:35:14,320
Stack was like you know this guy doesn't

2117
01:35:18,270 --> 01:35:15,550
have any reason to lie to me so I

2118
01:35:20,909 --> 01:35:18,280
believed what he told me and then he

2119
01:35:23,669 --> 01:35:20,919
launched into another story about how

2120
01:35:26,879 --> 01:35:23,679
his wife had gone and seen a psychic

2121
01:35:29,250 --> 01:35:26,889
when she first moved to California and

2122
01:35:30,929 --> 01:35:29,260
the psychic told her you know I don't

2123
01:35:32,699 --> 01:35:30,939
really see very much in your future but

2124
01:35:35,099 --> 01:35:32,709
you're going to end up marrying someone

2125
01:35:36,899 --> 01:35:35,109
who looks like Robert Stack and she

2126
01:35:40,829 --> 01:35:36,909
actually ended up marrying Robert Stack

2127
01:35:42,509 --> 01:35:40,839
so when I when we left that conversation

2128
01:35:44,459 --> 01:35:42,519
he was like you know so I don't doubt

2129
01:35:46,020 --> 01:35:44,469
what my friend told me about UFOs and I

2130
01:35:48,629 --> 01:35:46,030
also don't doubt that the psychic was

2131
01:35:50,250 --> 01:35:48,639
right so I guess those are the types of

2132
01:35:52,169 --> 01:35:50,260
things I believe and he kind of just

2133
01:35:56,099 --> 01:35:52,179
left it there yes I thought that was a

2134
01:35:59,849 --> 01:35:56,109
really really interesting appendix to

2135
01:36:03,349 --> 01:35:59,859
bring to this episode frog but um I

2136
01:36:06,750 --> 01:36:03,359
think we covered a lot here man this was

2137
01:36:08,699 --> 01:36:06,760
super fun to do with you but we're not

2138
01:36:12,119 --> 01:36:08,709
done we're not done a little news

2139
01:36:14,549 --> 01:36:12,129
Netflix is rebooting unsolved mysteries

2140
01:36:17,909 --> 01:36:14,559
with a the executive producers of

2141
01:36:19,560 --> 01:36:17,919
stranger things yeah hopefully someday

2142
01:36:21,750 --> 01:36:19,570
soon who knows with everything that's

2143
01:36:25,889 --> 01:36:21,760
going on in the world but I think it

2144
01:36:27,239 --> 01:36:25,899
comes out July 1st oh sweet okay yeah do

2145
01:36:27,750 --> 01:36:27,249
we know who's hosting it or anything

2146
01:36:29,969 --> 01:36:27,760
like that

2147
01:36:32,069 --> 01:36:29,979
I know we don't know a whole hell of a

2148
01:36:34,379 --> 01:36:32,079
lot about it which I'm kind of upset

2149
01:36:36,540 --> 01:36:34,389
about they've kind of kept it close to

2150
01:36:38,520 --> 01:36:36,550
the chest so I guess we'll see you know

2151
01:36:41,819 --> 01:36:38,530
what it comes out we haven't even heard

2152
01:36:44,479 --> 01:36:41,829
if there's like a host er what what the

2153
01:36:46,459 --> 01:36:44,489
format is gonna be is it just the

2154
01:36:49,190 --> 01:36:46,469
yeah is it just the name unsolved

2155
01:36:51,890 --> 01:36:49,200
mysteries or is it going to be - like it

2156
01:36:53,720 --> 01:36:51,900
used to so it should be it should be

2157
01:36:55,070 --> 01:36:53,730
interesting that's a good point yeah we

2158
01:36:56,870 --> 01:36:55,080
don't know if there's even gonna be a

2159
01:36:59,060 --> 01:36:56,880
host I mean it looks like they're only

2160
01:37:01,490 --> 01:36:59,070
covering one unsolved mystery every

2161
01:37:02,959 --> 01:37:01,500
episode yeah that'll be cool you know

2162
01:37:05,360 --> 01:37:02,969
we'll get a really in-depth look at

2163
01:37:06,920 --> 01:37:05,370
these things probably Jordan Peele I'm

2164
01:37:09,320 --> 01:37:06,930
going with him he's done Twilight Zone

2165
01:37:12,890 --> 01:37:09,330
he might as well do this show next right

2166
01:37:14,720 --> 01:37:12,900
yeah he'd be perfect for it yeah Rob

2167
01:37:18,290 --> 01:37:14,730
that's gonna do it here on the unsolved

2168
01:37:19,910 --> 01:37:18,300
mysteries UFO stack pack our on the main

2169
01:37:23,120 --> 01:37:19,920
feed but Rob you're gonna stick around

2170
01:37:25,310 --> 01:37:23,130
and cover a few more really good cases

2171
01:37:29,000 --> 01:37:25,320
of unsolved mysteries with me for a

2172
01:37:31,280 --> 01:37:29,010
patreon episode for our somewhere in the

2173
01:37:34,340 --> 01:37:31,290
skies patreon subscribers it'll be up

2174
01:37:37,120 --> 01:37:34,350
there for either right when this comes

2175
01:37:40,070 --> 01:37:37,130
out or just a little bit after but

2176
01:37:42,050 --> 01:37:40,080
before we go here on the main feed and

2177
01:37:43,640 --> 01:37:42,060
go over to patreon Rob where can we find

2178
01:37:45,320 --> 01:37:43,650
everything you're up to what do you got

2179
01:37:47,300 --> 01:37:45,330
going on with the podcast with your

2180
01:37:50,630 --> 01:37:47,310
patreon yeah give it to me man

2181
01:37:52,400 --> 01:37:50,640
the best places to keep updated for new

2182
01:37:55,180 --> 01:37:52,410
episodes and all that is our strange

2183
01:37:57,890 --> 01:37:55,190
guys calm you can also follow me on all

2184
01:37:59,750 --> 01:37:57,900
the social media platforms Twitter

2185
01:38:01,940 --> 01:37:59,760
Facebook Instagram and all that stuff

2186
01:38:05,479 --> 01:38:01,950
just search our strange skies and you

2187
01:38:08,090 --> 01:38:05,489
will be updated with UFO news and all

2188
01:38:09,290 --> 01:38:08,100
other sorts of crazy crap I love it I

2189
01:38:11,479 --> 01:38:09,300
love it man and you just did a

2190
01:38:13,430 --> 01:38:11,489
true-crime episode that literally blew

2191
01:38:15,650 --> 01:38:13,440
me away so I definitely suggest people

2192
01:38:18,440 --> 01:38:15,660
check that out too yeah I know do it

2193
01:38:22,600 --> 01:38:18,450
often but sometimes I'll step away and

2194
01:38:24,440 --> 01:38:22,610
do something that isn't so much UFOs but

2195
01:38:28,010 --> 01:38:24,450
yeah most of the time

2196
01:38:30,140 --> 01:38:28,020
UFOs yeah maybe another podcast oh [\h__\h]

2197
01:38:32,630 --> 01:38:30,150
take your follow your lead on that and

2198
01:38:34,160 --> 01:38:32,640
stop talking about UFOs for once again

2199
01:38:36,590 --> 01:38:34,170
I'm looking in the mirror this keeps

2200
01:38:38,930 --> 01:38:36,600
happening anyways

2201
01:38:41,060 --> 01:38:38,940
let's head on over to patreon in Rob

2202
01:38:43,610 --> 01:38:41,070
thank you again man for joining me on

2203
01:38:44,880 --> 01:38:43,620
somewhere in the skies I appreciate it

2204
01:39:04,830 --> 01:38:44,890
man thank you for having me back home

2205
01:39:05,930 --> 01:39:04,840
[Music]